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advice on purchase

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blackburn11

blackburn11

Member
Nov 12, 2017
19
0
Texas
I am new to the sport. I am 41 and haven't shot anything for about 25 years. I plan to target shoot and perhaps squirrel hunt. Will also eventually teach my daughter (10 years old) to shoot if I can ever get her interested.

I do not have much money to invest in the sport. Would say my budget is about $300. But I am in a unique position in that I will make an initial purchase and will attempt to NOT spend much more after that (issue with wife). So my number 1 priority is to get quality stuff for a sensible price and hopefully have it last 5 to 10 years! My 2nd priority is to have a gun that shoots smooth, accurate, and feels like a quality item.

I was going to buy a Gamo Wildcat Whisper .22 for $150 or a Gamo Whisper Fusion Mach 1 .22 for $290. Was leaning towards the latter for the variable zoom scope. But after lots of internet lurking, I was thinking about the following setup...

$300 - Umarex Gauntlet PCP Air Rifle
$120 - Leapers UTG 4-16x50 AO, EZ-TAP, Illuminated Mil-Dot Reticle, 1/4 MOA, 1" Tube
$50 - ebay - 3 Stage PCP Air Gun Rifle Filling Stirrup Pump Hand Pump 4500PSI
Total - $470

This certainly blows my budget and I will pay for it with some nagging down the road from the significant other. My questions are ...

Is this a sensible setup for under $500?
Will that cheap hand pump work/hold up?
Is this option significantly better than a spring gun with cheap scope for $250?
Would you recommend any changes in the scope or gun?
 
Sounds like you did your homework Blackburn. I would go with exactly what you have described.
I have placed an order through Pyramyd Air for Gaunlet in .177 . I might suggest also getting their " Ten for Ten " deal. That way you should be assured of less likely to get a gun with an air leak.

10-for-$10 Test! $10.00 
10-for-10. For just $10.00, you can buy peace of mind that your airsoft gun or airgun won't be a lemon!

To make sure your gun shoots right out of the box, our techs will:

Remove your gun from its box and fire 10 shots.
Confirm that the gun cocks reliably for all shots.
Verify that the trigger functions reliably for all shots.
Enclose chronograph tape.*
Make sure your gun doesn't leak (PCP, gas & CO2 airguns and airsoft guns).
List the air pressure used to shoot your gun (PCPs only).
Sign & date a certificate stating when the test was performed.
List the name and serial number of the tested gun on the certificate.
NOTE: Selecting this service will delay shipment by 24 hours (or one business day)


I picked up this little jewel of a scope to go on her when she gets here ;-)

https://www.amazon.com/TAC-Vector-Optics-Riflescope-Illuminated/dp/B013C98IUO/ref=redir_mobile_desktop?_encoding=UTF8&keywords=vectir%20opyics%2010-40x50%20sentinal&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_FMwebp_QL65&qid=1509743334&ref_=mp_s_a_1_sc_1&sr=8-1-spell

I chose the 10-40X50

Joe Wayne Rhea did a nice video review on the 4.5-18x 50 and was really pleased with it.


I can't help ya with the pump, my old arse gave that up within the first month! LOL

Best of luck with your new found hobby ;-)

Fuss

 
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I have a gamo urban and a hand pump. Won't talk about my scope because I'm going to replace it.

Hand pumping isn't fun. It's work. However, it's good exercise, and paying for the tanks and getting air is not only an expense I can't afford at the moment, but one I don't want. Eventually, I think most people that don't have a air source near by are going to end up with a compressor, but that's way out of your (and mine!) budget.

If you really catch the bug, you'll end up getting more later. That is the general rule with most hobbies. For now? That will probably work just fine.
 
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CampFussell, I will definitely take advantage of the 10 for $10 deal. That is a nice program.

I am worried about the hand pump. I see myself going out and shooting a tank (60 shots). I don't THINK the hand pump will wear me out. But I bet those are common last words by people right before they shell out the money for compressor.

Jimbo, your $1000 plus comment struck a cord with me. I can not let that happen. So you (along with others posting very nice springers) have me thinking about which way to go here. I just want to get the right gun first time around!

Thanks for responding. Look forward to the opinion of others.

 
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Get the Gaunlet...I dont have one but looked at it, single stage trigger is a possible downfall but if they do it right it may be just fine. It claims to have 60 shots per tank fill, IF you fill to max. I am a fan of .22...so many reasons, mainly hunting and slightly better in wind. 

As for the pump, mine gets used now and then. You can pick up non-carbon fiber tanks cheap but carbons go to 4500 psi, IF you can find a place that fills to that pressure. Just believe us that tanks are the cat's pajamas and go ahead and get one. Really, no question. A PCP without a fill tank is like getting a 50rd Thompson but handloading each round after a magazine is spent.

Dont cheap out on the glass...not to say that there isnt a $150 scope that would work (not many) but I will say dont bother with some $69 dollar jobber. Athlon makes good stuff but MTC/Optisan does as well and alot of new comers too in the first focal plane market to boot. I'd suggest having a power of 10x at least to see tiny lines or dots that we air gunners tend to test accuracy limits but you may like even higher powers. My current scope is a 2-15x Athlon Midas in SFP but may soon sell it for the FFP cousin Ares. I've used a Sightron SIII 10-50x and it's native power was 24x. 24x was where it looked best (past 30x was useless to me) and I could see a tack nail 1.2mm wide at 28 yards. Yet I enjoy my Midas much more on any power from 5x to 15x as the glass is clearer. For hunting you will use the lower powers alot.

Good luck.
 
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I started out with a springer but soon became frustrated with inconsistent accuracy. It takes a lot of skill and practice to be a good shooter with a springer. PCPs will keep you interested longer and you'll feel confident you'll hit what you're aiming at. The Gauntlet looks like a great gun, but my only concern for you is how big that tank is. Maybe someone can weigh in on the number of pumps required to fill that tank. The Diana Stormrider might be a good option too. $100 cheaper (or more for a refurbished one) or the Beeman QB Chief. Both have small tanks making it easier to fill. You probably won't go wrong with any of them, but I'd go .22 PCP and a hand pump first. No matter what you buy, find out what's the best pellet for your gun. It will really increase your enjoyment.

Good luck with your search
 
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Thanks to DuncanHynes... I think I got my scope!

Jusanothajoe, I will look into those recs. But for some reason I feel like I want to go with PCP. Though I am not sure exactly why.

GunBros, your concern about tank size? Did you mean the Gauntlet has a large tank? The Gauntlet has a 213cc tank (I think) compared to stormrider (100cc) and chief (136cc). Guess I thought that was a good thing.

Correct me if I am looking at this wrong. But I was thinking that instead of a springer... pump each time and single load or PCP where I get 20 shots. I would rather put my 240lb frame into about 50 - 60 pumps to fill the Gauntlet before going out. Because of the regulator, I get 60ish quality, relaxed, consistent shots. Then come home and call it a relaxing evening out. I like the idea that each shot is consistent because of the regulator and I put the work in before going out and enjoy some shooting.

Granted it all falls apart when I want to shoot 100+ shots and have to get pumping in the field.

Thoughts?
 
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I am just about like you, Blackburn. 41, got a little girl I want to get into shooting. I had a Pumpmaster as a kid, which got me hooked on high power airguns. If I'd have settled for something like a Red Ryder, I don't know that I'd have come back.
I re-entered the sport maybe 8 years ago now. 

I started with springers, and was a PCP naysayer. Finally, I gave in and tried one. A springer (including gas piston guns) that's accurate beyond 25 yards is going to cost as much as a mid-level PCP. (you don't want an entry level one, trust me) They're fun, but also heavy and require some real attention so the scopes don't wander and the zero doesn't wander. As environmental conditions shift, things move around and the first shot doesn't go to the same zero as subsequent shots. So if you're going to hunt with it, you have to zero with "first shot groups." Shoot one shot, adjust then wait awhile so it never heats up.

PCPs can seem daunting at first, but they really don't have to be. You DO need more gear to start with, but then you're set. You'll probably want to buy from a good retailer who will take care of you in case something goes south. (I like Straightshooters and Pyramyd, but there are a lot of others I haven't tried)

I think I'd get a Gamo Urban in .22. It's got a an English (BSA ) hammer-forged barrel, a slick action, and good balance. Not too long or heavy, so your daughter will be able to handle it easier. For the scope, I'd advise not to get less than 12X. If you can swing $190, a Hawke Vantage 4-12x50 is my current top pick for a good quality scope at a fair price. It's bright, even in low light, (thanks to the 50mm objective lens) has a lit reticle, so a target in the shadows or a pest animal at night can be hit. It's better than the UTG scopes, not so sensitive to eye position. Failing that, how about a UTG 10x44? 10x is a bit much for squirrels at 10 yards, but fine for everything else, and you won't have to worry about re-calculating your hold-over for every magnification. It's heavier than the Hawke I mentioned though. Make sure you get a mil dot reticle, so you can map your hold-overs out to your maximum range. Mounts are not that important on a PCP. I'm sure I'll catch flak for this, but expensive mounts are not that important on a PCP. Since the gun isn't slamming all over the place all the time, like on a springer or powderburner, they just need to be snug and $20 rings will be fine.

I have the Hawke I mentioned above. It's a good solid scope. Optically speaking, it's not great past 30 yards or so, but it does the job and is at least as good as an equivalent UTG with a lot less sensitive eye relief. I have had a Gamo Coyote, which has the same action as the Urban, but in a traditional wood stock. (and $200 more expensive) The action and barrel are excellent.

I would NOT get an Umarex anything. They have a pretty wretched customer service record. The Gauntlet is one of those guns that is good on paper, and may be good overall at a later date, but right now they've got teething pains. Also, they're not really available either, except for pre-order. Kind of like a first year of a brand new model car.

I will defer to others for an affordable pump option. See how much you're shooting and maybe add a SCUBA tank later. They can be pretty cheap, if you don't get a fiberglass-wrapped super high pressure one.

There are probably a lot of really good buys in a used gun, but you probably don't want to take on that risk, as a first-time buyer.

You may want to state your location. Probably the best thing you could do right now is visit an AGN member near to you and try HIS guns first!
 
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 I have a 231cc tube on ny Air Arms S500 and have had to top it off with my Hill mk3 hand pump from time to time. About 120 pumps from 2-3000psi no worries. I couldn't say for sure from full but likely around 400 pumps. The mk4 version is said to be easier to pump once past 2000psi but I couldn't say. As for the less expensive offerings I would imagine they may be a few generations behind so maybe reports on the original hill or fx pumps would be an accurate comparison.
 
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Woah. 120 pumps is more than I thought and 400 pumps is way more than I thought. But not necessarily a deal breaker. lol

Noob question. Do you store the gun with the pcp tank loaded? Can you store it at 2000 psi? Or do you need to empty it?

I have a 4500 psi fill station 20 minutes from my house. What kind of tank could/should I get for cheap? I am a bit overwhelmed by the options. And how many fills of the gun would I get with the tank?
 
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You DO want the regulator. And on the gamo/bsa do keep in mind the fill pressure ( 3,300psi ??? ) as well as many rigs general air use.

Keeping it cc's. I have hand pumped 490cc with both an FX and a sub $100 hand pump, both right at 500 strokes FROM EMPTY the first fill. The low cost pump being easier to use.
One might guess ( not to do otherwise until more solid numbers come in ) that per shot with a rig such as the gauntlet right at 2 pump strokes per shot fired, not counting filling the hose. When wasting air in such as set up ( max power ) more like 4 pump strokes per shot. Not bad at all, much less than "pumping" a benjamin sheridan of old 5-9 pumps per shot then repeat. You would only every need 500 ( 560 with hose &b leeding) strokes IF filling from dead empty. 
The secret to hand pumping is form, don't use your strength , lift handle / push down until elbows lock / suddenly drop all your weight / repeat. 

The gauntlet does seem available, fi , one really wants one. Umarex seemingly had a few listed for a few hours today ( I did not try clicking through ) but gone now. It seems a lot of non sponsoring PB type catalog stores have some. And if you read the dealer section here umarex claims many more coming asap.

A QB78HPA Ninja rig which uses the 13ci ninja regulated bottle, may be somewhat similar to a gauntlet, or not.
47cc9b69eb1148b29ac31baff1b9e151.jpg


John

 
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Keep a PCP at least at 150 BAR stored. You can leave it almost full at 200 BAR, the pressure is good to keep O-rings sealed/seated and moisture out. These figures are from my Wildcat. Another PCP may be different. These tanks on the gun are meant to be pressurized, wont hurt them. Dont store cocked though.

I read a few posts in regards to the rifles suggested. Umarex was frowned on in terms of customer service. FX technically says only see your dealer for support. I always thought that to be odd. I have zero experience with Umarex or any Turkish guns. We all can agree they are not the same ballpark as an AirArms, Daystate, FX, etc. But sometimes there is a workhorse to be had for cheap that surprises all. The Gaunlet finish looks cheaply made and rough around the edges. But it also looks accurate (videos on YouTube) with a larger tank for more shots. 3 year warranty, if they honor it is a plus.

That aside, a used gun would be my option/opinion mind you for a bit more. I have delt with enough members on here to know no one sells junk. They sell to make room or fund another project or to move on to the $1,000 or $2,000 PCP relm. A $500 or so used PCP with extras may serve better than a new Gaunlet. I'd spring for a BSA R10, AirArms S200/S510, FX (pick one). Not that these are $500 just saying some gems out there at really good prices. But if the buyer's budget is $300, that's the line that has to be drawn...for now. :)
 
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