My new tx200 is shooting wonderful. But about every 75 shots the accuracy starts to open up and upon inspection, one or more of the stock screws are loose. I’ve tried loctite. Anybody have any recommendations? Would a vortek 12 fpe kit be a good idea? I’m thinking less power might keep the screws tight. Has anybody used this kit in a tx200? I had so so luck with my hw95 and the pg4 kit. Thanks
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AA tx200 stock screws working loose
- Thread starter cgriff20
- Start date
Which of your stock screws are working loose?
For the two stock screws in the front, ....trying taking out the front mounting bracket, cleaning the front bracket and screw, and epoxying the front bracket mount to the action.
Then try the locktite again for the two front stock screws.
For the large trigger screw in front of your trigger. Try putting a used breech o ring seal between the stock and the trigger guard and tighten it snug. This will give a bit of tension and shock absorber action to that screw.
A 12 FPE kit is not a bad idea. Try Vortek and if budget is not an issue, I prefer the Tony Leach set up.
good luck
For the two stock screws in the front, ....trying taking out the front mounting bracket, cleaning the front bracket and screw, and epoxying the front bracket mount to the action.
Then try the locktite again for the two front stock screws.
For the large trigger screw in front of your trigger. Try putting a used breech o ring seal between the stock and the trigger guard and tighten it snug. This will give a bit of tension and shock absorber action to that screw.
A 12 FPE kit is not a bad idea. Try Vortek and if budget is not an issue, I prefer the Tony Leach set up.
good luck
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It seems the big trigger screw and the front 2 screws are working loose. Not a lot but as soon as I tighten them my groups shrink. Where can I buy tony leach tune kits?
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I use lock-tight and rtv on problem screws their is alot of good lock tight which should fix this
LOU
LOU
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I couldn’t keep the screws on the fore end tight so I drilled out the holes in the stock and epoxied in a pair of bushings I made on my lathe. I haven’t had to tighten the screws since installing them.
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Degrease the female threads with a Q- tip and lacquer thinner and the male threads with a rag and lacquer thinner until you see nothing on the Q-tip or the rag. Then shake the loctite up real well. It settles over time. Put the loctite sparingly on both female and male parts. Wait 24 hours. It will not come loose. May even have trouble removing the screws if to much loctite is used. Just a tiny drop on both parts.
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Correct....many folks dont go thru these steps and their loctite will fail! Why drop down to 12 fpe if you dont need to, mine is running at 15 fpe and smooth as can be. You need to use shims and weights to get the balance on the shot cycle with the weight of pellet your shooting. Smooth out the shot cycle and your screws will stay tight.
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This is a common problem with springers
I just check screws ever time I am finish shooting for the day
I just check screws ever time I am finish shooting for the day
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If the thread locker is applied properly and the rifle doesnt kick like a mule the screws should not be comming loose! Both my TX and my R1 have not come loose in the past 4 tins of pellets. I only check my screws every 3-6 months depending on how much I shoot, cant remember the last time my screws were loose...
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Recently I discovered with my new hw95 the screws was getting loose not because of turning, but because of the wood being compressed.
With brand new rifle I did 30 shots - checked the screws, and they got loose. I tightened them with a torque wrench. Then I did another 30 shots while watching the screws - so the screws didn’t turn, but when I applied the same amount of torque - the screws moved about a quarter of turn (the front screws - but the trigger guard did so little)
I did several sessions with each the screws was turning less and less (with the same torque) . And now after 50 shots, they stay put in place. (Will continue to watch).
My conclusion with the new rifle, to continue tightening down until it settles in , and then to use a thread lock if need be.
With brand new rifle I did 30 shots - checked the screws, and they got loose. I tightened them with a torque wrench. Then I did another 30 shots while watching the screws - so the screws didn’t turn, but when I applied the same amount of torque - the screws moved about a quarter of turn (the front screws - but the trigger guard did so little)
I did several sessions with each the screws was turning less and less (with the same torque) . And now after 50 shots, they stay put in place. (Will continue to watch).
My conclusion with the new rifle, to continue tightening down until it settles in , and then to use a thread lock if need be.
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I can't stand star lock washers that ride directly on wood. For RWS rifles and my Feinwerkbau 124D I made brass washers to be used between the wood and washer. I'm not sure what kind of a forearm screw setup the TX200 uses ??
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I don't use LocTite on any stock screw threads of any of my guns.
The wood can move or compress under the "fixed" screw and be loose without being loose if that makes sense. The screw can lose tension and you won't know it because it's locked in place with the threadlocker. It's a band-aid on a broken leg...
The TX uses a countersunk screw in a matching recess in the stock. Personally I find this to be a terrible design especially in wood. You can't get a good feel for the torque of the fastener due to the friction under the head. Also, it prohibits you from using any kind of lock washer, or metal-to-metal interface to give the screws a fighting chance of staying tight or achieving an accurate feel for torque. But you are stuck with it, so you have to make the best of it.
The aluminum bracket and corresponding threads for the stock screws also don't help things, as they naturally get wear and tear from the steel screw, thread engagement is reduced, and there goes your threads ability to remain tight. Exactly the reason that everyone else uses steel-to-steel thread connections. ARH used to make a stainless replacement, but stainless isn't much better and it's pretty much a waste of money.
Get the shot cycle right, and they won't need anything but a slight snug every once in a while, and it won't be enough to shift your POI all over the place. I'm not going to tell you what I think of the Vortek kits, we have been there already. I would make sure the piston seal is fitting and sealing well, make sure your breech seals and lockup is snug and not sloppy as some seem to be, and close a couple coils on the spring with heat to reduce the power if needed. Pellet fit also will make a big difference on shot cycle feel, too loose will make a slammy gun, and the last TX I had came with a fairly loose bore for JSB pellets...
The wood can move or compress under the "fixed" screw and be loose without being loose if that makes sense. The screw can lose tension and you won't know it because it's locked in place with the threadlocker. It's a band-aid on a broken leg...
The TX uses a countersunk screw in a matching recess in the stock. Personally I find this to be a terrible design especially in wood. You can't get a good feel for the torque of the fastener due to the friction under the head. Also, it prohibits you from using any kind of lock washer, or metal-to-metal interface to give the screws a fighting chance of staying tight or achieving an accurate feel for torque. But you are stuck with it, so you have to make the best of it.
The aluminum bracket and corresponding threads for the stock screws also don't help things, as they naturally get wear and tear from the steel screw, thread engagement is reduced, and there goes your threads ability to remain tight. Exactly the reason that everyone else uses steel-to-steel thread connections. ARH used to make a stainless replacement, but stainless isn't much better and it's pretty much a waste of money.
Get the shot cycle right, and they won't need anything but a slight snug every once in a while, and it won't be enough to shift your POI all over the place. I'm not going to tell you what I think of the Vortek kits, we have been there already. I would make sure the piston seal is fitting and sealing well, make sure your breech seals and lockup is snug and not sloppy as some seem to be, and close a couple coils on the spring with heat to reduce the power if needed. Pellet fit also will make a big difference on shot cycle feel, too loose will make a slammy gun, and the last TX I had came with a fairly loose bore for JSB pellets...
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I've noticed that JSB/AA Diablo 8.44 pellets are a very easy push into the breech of my new TX200. I have some OOOOLLLLLDDD Crosman Premier Lights that are a much tighter push into the breech. The old CPLs seem to group much better than the new JSB/AA Diablos 8.44 pellets.
Since I can't buy more CPLs when these are gone, is there a modern pellet that you would try (for FT) for a TX with a looser bore? Or do I need to buy a new barrel and hope it has a better fit?
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Im a fan of the CPL. It's about all I shoot in my HWs, and I have a decent stockpile of them thankfully. They are/were excellent pellets!
The FTTs can be a little snugger, but their consistency seems to be a little spotty sometimes.
The Heavy 10.3gr JSBs may be worth a try, the tin I had seemed bigger, but it could have just been the shape. Plus the extra weight may not be welcome for you and you're setup.
Man, I just really don't know.
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Well stated ! I get what you mean about the wood being compressed and sort of spongy to a degree.
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+1 on the de-greasing comments above.
Great post here on how to harden the wood under the screws to avoid compressing it:
https://airgunwarriors.com/community/airgun-talk/how-to-treat-your-stock-and-lock-tite-stock-screws-for-better-springer-accuracy-an-easy-but-new-tutorial/
Never owned a TX 200 (so apologies if this is not workable!), but thumper's note about friction under the head competing with the feel for torque applied is very true. On other guns I've solved that by simply putting a flat washer under the screw head, and applying a little lithium grease between the two. Gives a much better feel when tightening, and also makes a little "bond break" to help keep vibration from turning the screw out. Poor man's version of a screw cup seat, if you will.
Also check the stock inletting, be sure it's smooth and doesn't have any irregularities. I routinely run fine sandpaper through the main receiver bedding area - you will often see that the wood fibers are standing up a bit. Years ago I had a C1 Carbine whose screws would not stay tight, it turned out that a varnish run across the fore end inletting was acting as a mini-fulcrum, letting the action rock back and forth a little. Sanded that out, no further issues.
Great post here on how to harden the wood under the screws to avoid compressing it:
https://airgunwarriors.com/community/airgun-talk/how-to-treat-your-stock-and-lock-tite-stock-screws-for-better-springer-accuracy-an-easy-but-new-tutorial/
Never owned a TX 200 (so apologies if this is not workable!), but thumper's note about friction under the head competing with the feel for torque applied is very true. On other guns I've solved that by simply putting a flat washer under the screw head, and applying a little lithium grease between the two. Gives a much better feel when tightening, and also makes a little "bond break" to help keep vibration from turning the screw out. Poor man's version of a screw cup seat, if you will.
Also check the stock inletting, be sure it's smooth and doesn't have any irregularities. I routinely run fine sandpaper through the main receiver bedding area - you will often see that the wood fibers are standing up a bit. Years ago I had a C1 Carbine whose screws would not stay tight, it turned out that a varnish run across the fore end inletting was acting as a mini-fulcrum, letting the action rock back and forth a little. Sanded that out, no further issues.
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Have used the hardening of the wood method for years, makes a quick fix but one has to be carefull about overtightening!! For my personal springers I always make screw cups and convert to soc hd screws. Industrial socket head screws have a more precise thread than over the counter machine screws, probably made in china with poor quality threads. The cups spread the load over a larger area of wood and stops the compression. I also have all walnut stocks currently and being a much harder wood, I have not had wood compression issues. Beech is much softer so the hardening process is of greater advantage...
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