Ok been watching guys from Africa and they claim their. 22 impact is easily shooting over 80 ft lb. They also said the .25 can shoot over 95 ft lb. How the heck are they doing this? I have a mk2 with PP and bought huma high power reg, and huma dual port, and fx slug power kit pin probe. I set reg to 150 bar. Shooting 33.5gr (.25 cal) nsa slug. My hammer wheel is set to max. Valve adjustment is fully open. I'm pushing the 33.5gr nsa max up to 980 fps. I calculate that in PA calculator and it only give me about 71 ft lb. So how the heck am my .25 cal max out to only 71 ft lb, and they claim their .22 is easily over 80 ft lb. Isnt .25 suppose to be more powerful than a .22 cal? I'm not even close to that 95 ft lb they claim the .25 can do. What am I doing wrong here????
.22 over 80ft and .25 over 95 ft lb. How?
- Thread starter 2fast2furious
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I believe they are shooting .22 34gr slugs at about 1050fps.
As for .25 cal? Not sure because they can't have that Caliber in SA. Might be just a calculation?
As for .25 cal? Not sure because they can't have that Caliber in SA. Might be just a calculation?
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They probably aren't telling how modified these guns are. 38 grains running 980 fps calculates to 81 FPE. That is pretty salty, but in the realm of keeping things in usable velocity.
Some folks like to get things in the Stratosphere, and live there. African animals can be quite different from our usual target critters.
Sorry I can't answer your question other than the modifications, but I'm new to air and learning a lot. One of the things is people will stretch everything they can.
I have seen it in the powder world. Folks thinking 1000 yard riffle shots are simplistic and should be considered normal. 200 yard pistol shots? The same misconception. Using them for what is considered main stream is considered lame in some circles. I had a guy tell me how poor a shooter I was and my load was complete garbage while shooting a 2 1/4 inch 300 yard group one day. After four of us explained that was well under MOA, he still was stomping around. Some folks.
Some folks like to get things in the Stratosphere, and live there. African animals can be quite different from our usual target critters.
Sorry I can't answer your question other than the modifications, but I'm new to air and learning a lot. One of the things is people will stretch everything they can.
I have seen it in the powder world. Folks thinking 1000 yard riffle shots are simplistic and should be considered normal. 200 yard pistol shots? The same misconception. Using them for what is considered main stream is considered lame in some circles. I had a guy tell me how poor a shooter I was and my load was complete garbage while shooting a 2 1/4 inch 300 yard group one day. After four of us explained that was well under MOA, he still was stomping around. Some folks.
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This may not be news to you but the weight of the projectile can be a factor. A heavier slug will take longer to leave the barrel and as a result will spend more time accelerating than a light pellet. It will actually pick up more energy.
I don't know if this is the case for FX valves, but in addition to the effect I mention above, in airforce guns the "plug" effect of the heavy slug in the barrel also changes valve behavior, causing the valve to stay open for longer, dumping more air and as a result adding more energy (and noise). Maybe they were using heavy slugs?
All of this is based on information shared with me by a couple of other users and my own limited experience. I'm not sure how universal this is because I haven't shot a wide range of airguns.
I don't know if this is the case for FX valves, but in addition to the effect I mention above, in airforce guns the "plug" effect of the heavy slug in the barrel also changes valve behavior, causing the valve to stay open for longer, dumping more air and as a result adding more energy (and noise). Maybe they were using heavy slugs?
All of this is based on information shared with me by a couple of other users and my own limited experience. I'm not sure how universal this is because I haven't shot a wide range of airguns.
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HI first off you did not say if you are using a 700mm barrel ? ok so assuming you shooting with 700mm barrel , I believe the HUMAport may not give you the highest fpe for the transfer port , the modded ones seem to get over 10fpe more by matching everything up and using a pellet probe with a pin , OPK ,
Next the them guys shooting 22 cal with 40 grains with a reg setting of 170 to 175 bar ,, so yes you being at 150 if you shot heavy ammo and raised reg and maybe reduced valve return spring and maybe add extra weight to hammer I think you can be over 95fpe with your gun ,
However alot of guys here will tell you as I am , maxing out everything is not practicable and it isnt most accurate and shot count will suffer if you max things and then vibrations and noise goes up with higher settings ,
SO if you want to see by all means but in end tune gun for ammo you like and alot of slugs are not as accurate if shot too fast .so tuns gun for best groups at 100 yds ,or 50 where ever you usually hunt or shoot at , either way a 25 cal at 70 ot 95 fpe can do same damage to small game , and both can shoot extended ranges .
LOU
so heavier slugs and heavier hammer , lighter return spring for valve raise reg to 170bar max out , then retune for accuracy you will find it shoots better 10 to 15% less power then maxed
Next the them guys shooting 22 cal with 40 grains with a reg setting of 170 to 175 bar ,, so yes you being at 150 if you shot heavy ammo and raised reg and maybe reduced valve return spring and maybe add extra weight to hammer I think you can be over 95fpe with your gun ,
However alot of guys here will tell you as I am , maxing out everything is not practicable and it isnt most accurate and shot count will suffer if you max things and then vibrations and noise goes up with higher settings ,
SO if you want to see by all means but in end tune gun for ammo you like and alot of slugs are not as accurate if shot too fast .so tuns gun for best groups at 100 yds ,or 50 where ever you usually hunt or shoot at , either way a 25 cal at 70 ot 95 fpe can do same damage to small game , and both can shoot extended ranges .
LOU
so heavier slugs and heavier hammer , lighter return spring for valve raise reg to 170bar max out , then retune for accuracy you will find it shoots better 10 to 15% less power then maxed
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Rallyshark has a thread on here about shooting over 80 FPE with a .22 Maverick. He modded it and shooting pressures that I believe hit 180 on the 2nd reg.
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My current tune is about 130 bar on impact mk2 700 mm .25 cal. Power wheel at 5 slinging 37 gr cast slugs at 922. But the tune isn’t proper cause I lose speed at max. But the groups down range are laser in the heavy superior liner. This equates to 70.5 FPE. Running slug pin probe and Ernest Rowe dual port.
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JWrabbit is correct. The list he gave you will give you additional velocity. The heavier hammer , lighter return spring for the valve and raising the reg to 170bar are recent changes I have made on my .30 cal. Mk2 Impact with a 700 mm barrel. I'm pushing the 49.5 gr. Nielson slugs at around 1010-1015 fps with fairly decent accuracy. Shot count is reduced significantly running the regulator that high, but if you need the extra ft. Lbs for hunting the reduced shot count probably doesn't matter.
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With my Gen 1 impact I am shooting the NSA 36.2 slugs at over 1020fps for near 85fpe. A heavier projectile and a tiny bit more reg pressure would take me up over 90fpe for sure.
Mods to my .25 700 gun are as follows;
Ported barrel and probe.
ported valve seat to 6.1mm
Added a 1.25mm brass shim to the hammer
Power plenum equivalent
Valve spring moved outside of the plenum and a lighter weight spring was installed.
Reg set at 135-140bar
Power wheel set at 5 or 6
Valve adjuster set near line 3
I have been a bit conservative on my tuning the ports could all be larger and the reg could be set higher as well. But I actually shot the gun at 74fpe for laser like accuracy to 200 plus yards so there is no need for me to push it beyond this point.
The gun is now a .22 500mm superior as I am on the list for an M3 and will use it for the longer ranges.
Mods to my .25 700 gun are as follows;
Ported barrel and probe.
ported valve seat to 6.1mm
Added a 1.25mm brass shim to the hammer
Power plenum equivalent
Valve spring moved outside of the plenum and a lighter weight spring was installed.
Reg set at 135-140bar
Power wheel set at 5 or 6
Valve adjuster set near line 3
I have been a bit conservative on my tuning the ports could all be larger and the reg could be set higher as well. But I actually shot the gun at 74fpe for laser like accuracy to 200 plus yards so there is no need for me to push it beyond this point.
The gun is now a .22 500mm superior as I am on the list for an M3 and will use it for the longer ranges.
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I stress tested one of my Veterans a while back maxed out, shooting the .217 40gr Griffin BTs (largest that will in the magazines). The first shot registered at 1160fps, and the rest were 1137-1140fps until it fell off the regulator. Pretty close to 120FPE, but the shot cycle wasn't as nasty as I expected it to be.
That projectile has not been accurate over ~1040fps with any of the barrels that I have setup for the Taipans, and I had some of them take some pretty crazy nosedives 40-50m out when I shot them supersonic. I spent a lot of time trying to get them to shoot well at the highest velocities, but I accepted that they shoot best from 940-1030.
Dale Riggert has been very cool in helping me find ammo that will shoot accurately at high velocities. I have a bunch of ammo that he made that I need to finish testing when the weather finally clears up here.
Getting that power output has taken some time, but I machine heavy duty valves and hammer systems for my test rifles, and I spent a lot of time testing different ideas with lots of trial, error until I have found success. 120FPE .22 hasn't been the most accurate, but I can definitely configure the rifles to be laser accurate at 90-100FPE using specific slugs.
That projectile has not been accurate over ~1040fps with any of the barrels that I have setup for the Taipans, and I had some of them take some pretty crazy nosedives 40-50m out when I shot them supersonic. I spent a lot of time trying to get them to shoot well at the highest velocities, but I accepted that they shoot best from 940-1030.
Dale Riggert has been very cool in helping me find ammo that will shoot accurately at high velocities. I have a bunch of ammo that he made that I need to finish testing when the weather finally clears up here.
Getting that power output has taken some time, but I machine heavy duty valves and hammer systems for my test rifles, and I spent a lot of time testing different ideas with lots of trial, error until I have found success. 120FPE .22 hasn't been the most accurate, but I can definitely configure the rifles to be laser accurate at 90-100FPE using specific slugs.
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I think what everyone else is saying is pretty spot on. The guys making those high power numbers are shooting with their regs at 170 bar(and sometimes higher). I was able to get some pretty high numbers from my Maverick, but those super high numbers were with the reg at 180 too. I have the Huma extra high pressure regs, so there's no issue there for me to do that. That being said, I would only use the gun tuned at those high levels for very specific situations. Generally, my gun lives with the reg at 155-160 bar, and it is very happy there. I don't have a .25, but the gun's happy place in .22 is in the 65-70 fpe. It is crazy accurate at those power levels with the NSA 31.2 grain ammo, even well past 200 yards. Another missing piece of the equation could be in the hammer weight department. If you can't crack the valve well at those higher reg settings, the power won't increase at the higher regulator settings, and may even decrease some.
So yeah, you'll need more regulator pressure, and possibly hammer weight to make it to the power levels you quoted. Oh, and the probe seating depth could also be too shallow, and leaving the rear of the slug hanging over the barrel port some. I generally like my probe length where it is seating the slugs as far as possible, without causing any loading issues, of course. I hope that helps
So yeah, you'll need more regulator pressure, and possibly hammer weight to make it to the power levels you quoted. Oh, and the probe seating depth could also be too shallow, and leaving the rear of the slug hanging over the barrel port some. I generally like my probe length where it is seating the slugs as far as possible, without causing any loading issues, of course. I hope that helps
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I think what everyone else is saying is pretty spot on. The guys making those high power numbers are shooting with their regs at 170 bar(and sometimes higher). I was able to get some pretty high numbers from my Maverick, but those super high numbers were with the reg at 180 too. I have the Huma extra high pressure regs, so there's no issue there for me to do that. That being said, I would only use the gun tuned at those high levels for very specific situations. Generally, my gun lives with the reg at 155-160 bar, and it is very happy there. I don't have a .25, but the gun's happy place in .22 is in the 65-70 fpe. It is crazy accurate at those power levels with the NSA 31.2 grain ammo, even well past 200 yards. Another missing piece of the equation could be in the hammer weight department. If you can't crack the valve well at those higher reg settings, the power won't increase at the higher regulator settings, and may even decrease some.
So yeah, you'll need more regulator pressure, and possibly hammer weight to make it to the power levels you quoted. Oh, and the probe seating depth could also be too shallow, and leaving the rear of the slug hanging over the barrel port some. I generally like my probe length where it is seating the slugs as far as possible, without causing any loading issues, of course. I hope that helps
What size NSA slugs are you using. .216, .217 or ??
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Thats very high fpe in 22. MTNghost? would like some details on the build? i have a Veteran and would like to push as fast as i can with heavier slugs in .25. what pressure are you running at and valve and port sizes?
My impact made 110fpe in .25 at 170bar 38.5 slugs. 7mm valve seat 8mm poppet. 29 grams hammer. heavier spring. oh...9ci plenum+ power plenum. would not shoot that high, shot count went down and accuracy down
I generally machine my stuff and modd stuff on my own but i love sharing infors into the mods. no guess work
My impact made 110fpe in .25 at 170bar 38.5 slugs. 7mm valve seat 8mm poppet. 29 grams hammer. heavier spring. oh...9ci plenum+ power plenum. would not shoot that high, shot count went down and accuracy down
I generally machine my stuff and modd stuff on my own but i love sharing infors into the mods. no guess work
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I think what everyone else is saying is pretty spot on. The guys making those high power numbers are shooting with their regs at 170 bar(and sometimes higher). I was able to get some pretty high numbers from my Maverick, but those super high numbers were with the reg at 180 too. I have the Huma extra high pressure regs, so there's no issue there for me to do that. That being said, I would only use the gun tuned at those high levels for very specific situations. Generally, my gun lives with the reg at 155-160 bar, and it is very happy there. I don't have a .25, but the gun's happy place in .22 is in the 65-70 fpe. It is crazy accurate at those power levels with the NSA 31.2 grain ammo, even well past 200 yards. Another missing piece of the equation could be in the hammer weight department. If you can't crack the valve well at those higher reg settings, the power won't increase at the higher regulator settings, and may even decrease some.
So yeah, you'll need more regulator pressure, and possibly hammer weight to make it to the power levels you quoted. Oh, and the probe seating depth could also be too shallow, and leaving the rear of the slug hanging over the barrel port some. I generally like my probe length where it is seating the slugs as far as possible, without causing any loading issues, of course. I hope that helps
What size NSA slugs are you using. .216, .217 or ??
I'm shooting .218.
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I sure would love to have a Fraction of the $$$ and time some folks spend trying to turn their pellet guns into .22 rimfires.
Just sayin.
Mike
Just sayin.
Mike
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G
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Its time consuming yes but dosent really cost much as long as you can do something your self and know what you are doing. Why would you stay in RF category tho when you can far exceed ballistics of 22rf with 22airgun..
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Far exceed ballistics? My .22lr bullets have BC of around .15, unless you have a crazy custom gun I don't see you getting something with a higher BC than a .22lr that can push them fast enoug. I don't see how it's not alot more work and money.
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Total money spent under 600$ including everything except scope. 224cal bullets 50+grainers at 1000fps with BC all the way to 0.21. Dosent need to be expensive. Freaking time consuming 100% agreed.
I think what everyone else is saying is pretty spot on. The guys making those high power numbers are shooting with their regs at 170 bar(and sometimes higher). I was able to get some pretty high numbers from my Maverick, but those super high numbers were with the reg at 180 too. I have the Huma extra high pressure regs, so there's no issue there for me to do that. That being said, I would only use the gun tuned at those high levels for very specific situations. Generally, my gun lives with the reg at 155-160 bar, and it is very happy there. I don't have a .25, but the gun's happy place in .22 is in the 65-70 fpe. It is crazy accurate at those power levels with the NSA 31.2 grain ammo, even well past 200 yards. Another missing piece of the equation could be in the hammer weight department. If you can't crack the valve well at those higher reg settings, the power won't increase at the higher regulator settings, and may even decrease some.
So yeah, you'll need more regulator pressure, and possibly hammer weight to make it to the power levels you quoted. Oh, and the probe seating depth could also be too shallow, and leaving the rear of the slug hanging over the barrel port some. I generally like my probe length where it is seating the slugs as far as possible, without causing any loading issues, of course. I hope that helps
What size NSA slugs are you using. .216, .217 or ??
I'm shooting .218.
Cool. Thank you
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" I sure would love to have a Fraction of the $$$ and time some folks spend trying to turn their pellet guns into .22 rimfires." yes um.
Got back into pre-charged airguns in '99 due to surgery and needing keep up practice so naturally need (roughly) .22rf so spent the HUGE $500.00 on a B.B. gun, started buying custom swagged slugs and even played with helium all with outstanding rf quality's. Then as it was a different power source just for kicks went bi-bore.
Took me until around 2003 to discover (by accident just took my .22 squirrel rifle w/4x to the GOB club) the holly grail of airgun nirvana ............ small bore! .177 baby that's where it's at! THE fun educational utilitarian the way it should be airgun caliber. yes um
Perhaps I am simply that odd (thrifty/poor/cheap whatever) that were I looking for a slug shooter that might shoot the occasional MOA at 100m -all I could hope for- I would again simply purchase a Career 707II and shoot 43g @ 1040 all day without tinkering or even a bad o-ring for a decade at a time. Not the latest greatest, not a tinkers dream child and not needy but all for the price of a couple of mods on a latest airgun.
And I must admit they are all fun and it does seem many these days are looking for more to do than simply buy ready to go rig and shoot it.
John
Got back into pre-charged airguns in '99 due to surgery and needing keep up practice so naturally need (roughly) .22rf so spent the HUGE $500.00 on a B.B. gun, started buying custom swagged slugs and even played with helium all with outstanding rf quality's. Then as it was a different power source just for kicks went bi-bore.
Took me until around 2003 to discover (by accident just took my .22 squirrel rifle w/4x to the GOB club) the holly grail of airgun nirvana ............ small bore! .177 baby that's where it's at! THE fun educational utilitarian the way it should be airgun caliber. yes um
Perhaps I am simply that odd (thrifty/poor/cheap whatever) that were I looking for a slug shooter that might shoot the occasional MOA at 100m -all I could hope for- I would again simply purchase a Career 707II and shoot 43g @ 1040 all day without tinkering or even a bad o-ring for a decade at a time. Not the latest greatest, not a tinkers dream child and not needy but all for the price of a couple of mods on a latest airgun.
And I must admit they are all fun and it does seem many these days are looking for more to do than simply buy ready to go rig and shoot it.
John
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