"Arrow or the indian?"

There does come a time where & when the "Indian" owns his skill set completely.
As such can adapt to differences in gear ( Arrows * bows ) and still able to do his job at an above average level ... In the end IMO there both important, but a less than skilled indian with better than average gear can & may get lucky time to time, tho will lack consistency. Where as a highly skilled Indian with less than ideal gear is likely to be far more consistent & successful overall.

Good read tho

Arrow ... locked down, bolted down, calculating scope, input variables, just have to pull the trigger ... dead accurate shot. Barely need skills anymore. Unless your trigger finger doesn't work.

Franklink said:

Thread 'Field Target is an arms race.' https://www.airgunnation.com/threads/field-target-is-an-arms-race.1324782/

Some variation of "the arrow or the indian" popped up in that discussion probably a good 30+ times. I recently ran across this quote and it gave me a good snicker.

"The flight of the arrow is as true as the skill and the nerve of the man with the bow." Attributed to the legendary Fred Bear.

Interesting thing about that quote is the 60ish years he spent pursuing better equipment. Obviously he was a businessman, and the parallel goal was surely to make money and have a successful company, but engrained in that business side of things was his perpetual march towards better equipment. He was granted various patents for his advancements in archery over those decades of the pursuit of "better."

Better might be the enemy of good, but I'll take better over good when it comes to my field target equipment any day for the week, and twice on Sundays.

Nothing new here really, just a reiteration that it takes "better" equipment, and "the skill and nerve" to use it to its capacity to win ft matches. Ie, those who win matches are those with the better equipment, and the work ethic to spend time figuring out how to get the most out of it (practice).

Click to expand...

Definitely true. Below is an example using the bench rest discipline, but it is not FT which is understandably different. Still, the same concepts still apply.

All one has to do is to browse the ‘Finland World Championship BR thread’ to see the results achieved by the USA team ( Mike N, Jeff and Bob ) using great equipment ( I.e., Thomas AG) and a very high level of competition match experience and skill. Their work ethic is exceptional with enormous time practicing and it is paying off.

There is an old saying, "money ruins everything". Living in a time and place of relative wealth, it is hard to find a sport or hobby that isn't heavily influenced by money. There are attempts to mitigate by rules and classes, such as Showroom Stock in auto racing, and the various Sporter classes in target competition. Max Verstappen will beat me in identical, unmodified cars, but he may not set any records in the process, and his pace will be a virtual crawl compared to his time in his F1 car. Max's "base salary" this season is $65 million, a recognition of competence. While comparable equipment becomes more difficult for folks of modest means to attain, the competitor of greater skill will win. Even in sports without expensive equipment needs, money buys training and fitness. As I see it, the operator will always be the deciding factor, but the state of the art in equipment marches forward.

I think there is almost unanimous agreement in this thread.

Equipment and money are important, but the high level of skill and practice to compete at the highest levels……

***money can’t buy***

The best gun a man can have is the one in his hands. With enough practice.....and desire.....anything is possible.

Ever notice how that phrase is almost always said by the people with the fanciest bows/arrows?

Jezter6 said:

Ever notice how that phrase is almost always said by the people with the fanciest bows/arrows?

Click to expand...

Or said more correctly ... Said by those with & using the more capable equipment.
Nothing wrong once one has the skill to have equipment that can be 100% relied on.

The old indian uses the best arrows he can afford. He also asks older indians for tips and tricks. This indian does, anyway.

Jezter6 said:

Ever notice how that phrase is almost always said by the people with the fanciest bows/arrows?

Click to expand...

Nobody is going to overcome the guns group size by aiming and pulling the trigger, ever.

ChickenDumpling said:

Arrow ... locked down, bolted down, calculating scope, input variables, just have to pull the trigger ... dead accurate shot. Barely need skills anymore. Unless your trigger finger doesn't work.

Click to expand...

OH if it was only that easy !

Even the most skilled Indian armed with the best bow won't bring home much meat if he's shooting bad arrows. However the astute Indian, realizing that his equipment handicap is less than ideal arrow material, will work within the limits of his equipment to improve success.

And in some cases, perhaps discover that even bows and arrows of materials perceived as less than ideal can be capable of bringing home the bacon if he is careful enough to choose the RIGHT less than ideal bow and arrow materials.

Examples- the best primitive bow material grows notoriously crooked, knotted, and otherwise less than ideal for building a bow. However when carefully chosen, and skillfully crafted, an Osage (Bois D'Arc) bow outshoots and outlasts any other primitive bow. Some astute Indians realized that fact; no doubt from huge investments it time, labor, blood, sweat and tears (ask how I know). At some point white settlers realized the impervious nature of Osage, yet relegated it to such ignoble purposes as fence-posts and wind-breaks.



Another example- Well crafted cane arrow shafts, fletched with buzzard ass-feathers, can shoot as well as the the best wooden arrows fletched with eagle feathers.

One more example- Indians largely abandoned stone arrowheads in favor of iron arrowheads... made from the white man's discarded whiskey barrel bands. Maybe not exactly "water from wine", but definitely an excellent example of "one man's trash is another man's treasure".

I was gifted this arrow, identical to those in the mini-series Lonesome Dove, by the bowyer that made and provided the Indian bows and arrows used in L.D. The director was so impressed with the arrows that he decided to add a scene featuring a good close-up of one. That added scene is the arrow impaling Gus's saddle in the creek-bed. BTW, my bowyer buddy used a genuine, well-rusted whiskey barrel band to make the arrowhead(s).

Your's Truly,
Makes Meat With Crummy Bows (AKA- Still crazy after all these years)






Correction- Still crazy after all these decades.





.

Franklink said:

Thread 'Field Target is an arms race.' https://www.airgunnation.com/threads/field-target-is-an-arms-race.1324782/

Some variation of "the arrow or the indian" popped up in that discussion probably a good 30+ times. I recently ran across this quote and it gave me a good snicker.

"The flight of the arrow is as true as the skill and the nerve of the man with the bow." Attributed to the legendary Fred Bear.

Interesting thing about that quote is the 60ish years he spent pursuing better equipment. Obviously he was a businessman, and the parallel goal was surely to make money and have a successful company, but engrained in that business side of things was his perpetual march towards better equipment. He was granted various patents for his advancements in archery over those decades of the pursuit of "better."

Better might be the enemy of good, but I'll take better over good when it comes to my field target equipment any day for the week, and twice on Sundays.

Nothing new here really, just a reiteration that it takes "better" equipment, and "the skill and nerve" to use it to its capacity to win ft matches. Ie, those who win matches are those with the better equipment, and the work ethic to spend time figuring out how to get the most out of it (practice).

Click to expand...

Once one has the combination of equipment and ammo capable of the highest scores it then comes down to "accuracy"/(how perfectly placed each shot is) which is determined by the projectile sender, a person which has the edge to achieve that extra point needed to get that top score.

In the past summer months I've come to the conclusion that I lack that edge because if I practice it isn't much so I've been relying on my old intuitions from years gone by which mostly nets some 2nd places, lol!
I fool myself by thinking I can do better than I do without sending lots of lead downrange but I shoot against those that do that very thing and it shows in the match results. The truth is that their wind intuition is more seasoned from "doing" rather than me and my hopium on match day, lol.

But there is that luck factor thing which puts some irony into the equation like if when one is shooting and the wind lays down vs when the others get a windy situation when they are shooting.

Of course the ultimate is those that practice and have the luck factor going for them as well.

I see that putting in the work pays it's dividends.