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Help selecting PCP HFT rifle

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Motorhead said:
We'll have too agree to disagree on that. heavier / longer are more stable for most. As to brand and there success on the FT fields ... regional thing I'm sure.
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Generally speaking longer and heavier is better for precision shooting. But everyone is different and depends on situation.

Looks like OP is deciding on RAW and Styre, I would pick the raw between the 2 just because of parts availability.
 
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jps2486 said:
I recommend the RAW, either the TM or HM. I shot HFT with an HM1000 using magazines rather than fumbling around with single loading. There's no difference in accuracy IMO. Another good choice is the Daystate Red Wolf or even the Wolverine. More money than the RAW, though. Steyr? One of my friends shoots one and seems to have plenty of issue with it, especially leaks. Stay away from the tactical rifles.
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I am looking to buy a HFT and I like the Raw. They dont have the 0.177. The club I go to requires under 20 lb. And then the consensus is 850 to 900 FPS for optimal accuracy, which brings down the speed to under 800 fps for a 14 gr pellet. So how would you achieve the optimal speed?
 
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Liontracks said:
I am looking to buy a HFT and I like the Raw. They dont have the 0.177. The club I go to requires under 20 lb. And then the consensus is 850 to 900 FPS for optimal accuracy, which brings down the speed to under 800 fps for a 14 gr pellet. So how would you achieve the optimal speed?
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Hi,
My 2 cents - use a .22 for HFT if it is going to be your only air rifle and you want to do pesting or hunting with it also. If you are shooting American Field Target (Hunter Class) you are limited to 20 FPE. Typically, folks use AA or JSB 13.4 gr .22 pellets shooting them around 820 fps. They can be very accurate, though the trajectory will not be as flat as a .177 (unless you are shooting 13.4's in .177 of course).

I have been pretty successful in Hunter Class using a .177 shooting at 820 fps. The hard part of FT is not getting your dope figured out, it is ranging accurately and reading the wind. I have shot some really good 30 and 40 yd cards in the AGN 30yd challenge using the .177 at 820 fps. In fact, most of the shooters on that thread who are shotting the 13.4's are at 820 fps or lower, and there is no requirement limiting speed. They just seem to shoot better there.

Cheers,
Greg
 
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Liontracks said:
I am looking to buy a HFT and I like the Raw. They dont have the 0.177. The club I go to requires under 20 lb. And then the consensus is 850 to 900 FPS for optimal accuracy, which brings down the speed to under 800 fps for a 14 gr pellet. So how would you achieve the optimal speed?
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You'll be at a disadvantage using 22 cal for any type of sub 20 fpe FT. Either the BC is going to be low or going very slow with higher BC 22 cal pellets. Best to stick with 17 cal unless you don't care much about missing and missing isn't fun. I tried this a few times as an experiment and I was missing the faceplate when the wind kicked up, also shooting my lowest score using JSB 15.9gr which has the same BC as the JSB 10.3 .177. Plus more chance of splits on the edge of the face plate. It all added up to disappointment for me.

But there are guys in my club that are having good success with 20 cal in FT. A tad more BC so good in the wind but not all that slow with the lighter pellets. Just saying this because 20 cal is going to be a custom thing.

Killing small game with 17 cal around 20fpe isn't all that hard if you stay within normal airgun distances and place the shot right and if I was using 22 cal for hunting it'd be 30 fpe or preferably twice that.

This is the dilemma when we try to shoehorn different use cases.
 
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22 cal is available in 13.43 grains so they will be the same weight as the 177 monsters, I never had much luck with the 16 grain pellets in 22 at FT speeds. 22 uses a bit less air over 177 for the same weight of pellet.

My only issue running 22 in FT was I was using an unregulated rifle so I had to watch my power curve like a hawk (there was no 2% rule), those 22's like to go as fast as they can. My barrel was extremely accurate and shot better than any 177 barrel I have had to date. I'll take my chances on a split when I know i'm just under 1/2" at 55 yards versus shooting 177 with over a 3/4" group at 55 yards.

One way to do this would be to buy a 22 rifle with a power wheel (hammer spring) adjuster, set the reg for a slightly higher power than 20 ft-lbs and back off the hammer spring for field target, screw that sucker down for hunting and just run two different dope cards.
 
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NAProf said:
In fact, most of the shooters on that thread who are shooting the 13.4's are at 820 fps or lower, and there is no requirement limiting speed. They just seem to shoot better there.
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Interesting, I ran a few above 820 and started seeing them spiral at distance... Moved away from 815 and been running them around 800 and seeing better results. I found this out at a match unfortunately.
 
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NAProf said:
Hi,
My 2 cents - use a .22 for HFT if it is going to be your only air rifle and you want to do pesting or hunting with it also. If you are shooting American Field Target (Hunter Class) you are limited to 20 FPE. Typically, folks use AA or JSB 13.4 gr .22 pellets shooting them around 820 fps. They can be very accurate, though the trajectory will not be as flat as a .177 (unless you are shooting 13.4's in .177 of course).

I have been pretty successful in Hunter Class using a .177 shooting at 820 fps. The hard part of FT is not getting your dope figured out, it is ranging accurately and reading the wind. I have shot some really good 30 and 40 yd cards in the AGN 30yd challenge using the .177 at 820 fps. In fact, most of the shooters on that thread who are shotting the 13.4's are at 820 fps or lower, and there is no requirement limiting speed. They just seem to shoot better there.

Cheers,
Greg
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Thank you Greg. Question, if you have been successful with 0.177 why are you recommending .22?
 
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Liontracks said:
Thank you Greg. Question, if you have been successful with 0.177 why are you recommending .22?
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Sorry for the confusion. If you are only buying one rifle and FT is just one of several things you want to do with it (pesting, hunting, etc) then maybe a .22 is better. If FT is the most important and the other things are not as important, then get a .177.

I have two.177 rifles (a primary FT and a backup FT) and a .22 for when I go to my brother's house and we do some small game hunting. I also shoot the .22 in the AGN 30/40yd Challenge because at 40 yds I can shoot a very good card without having to wait for a really still day. I have some longer-range spinners set up and it is sometimes fun to see how well I do at 70 - 100 yds. Not going to do those with the .177.

Cheers,
Greg
 
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steve123 said:
Yeah but the BC is low like .023 or so for that 22 pellet vs .032 for the 17 cal.

So its just making things harder and it's almost getting like WFTF against 20 fpe rifles.
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I was very successful in FT with 22cal.

If you can reduce your overall group size at 55 yards with 22 over 177 that is an advantage.

If everything shot perfectly (which is does not) then the 177 is going to be better (obviously), unfortunately I haven't been able to purchase a barrel in 177 that shoots better than the 22 barrel I used.

So in my case BC has no bearing, use or function in FT unless i'm trying to put together the perfect pellet barrel combination.

The wrinkle in that "perfect" barrel/pellet combo is that I have purchased seven new LW barrels over the years and NONE of them have shot well at all (177, 20 & 22), around $1500 in barrels alone, add a bit more for machining... I have five barrels on the bench to test currently and I don't care what caliber they are if they shoot better than my current barrel.

I guess the nuance i'm getting at here is that any caliber will work for FT if it is accurate and it makes no sense to shoot a technically better performing pellet if it is not as accurate as the others.

The guy that won the Worlds would have beat Open & Hunter shooters on the same course (he scored 49/50 on the first day). In my world there is no real difference between power levels, just different numbers to follow to get the hit.
 
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