HW/Weihrauch 20 cal Rematch

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Mycapt65

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Apr 24, 2019
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Today I tried to beat the rain and see if I could do better than last time. Here's a page of targets from my two HW 20s. Definitely better than last time around.

Horizontal lines one and two is my Hw98.
Line one is FTTs
Line two is JSB 13.73
20240222_132654.jpg


Lines three and four is my blue R9.
Line three is FTTs
Line four is JSB 13.73
20240222_132437.jpg

All groups are five shots at 25 yards. Red dots are 3/4".
20240222_132309.jpg

Bottom was sighters. Each gun got six sighter/fouling rounds with each pellet before shooting for groups.
Have a great day all
Ron
 
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Sqwirl57 said:
Looks like the 98 won by a hair but I've still gotta say I think thats one of the coolest R9 I've ever seen. Nice shooting man
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Thanks.
beerthief said:
nice shooting , i have settled on one patch thru the barrel and 10 fouling shots , just me and random "feels good " number .
Which gun feels right to you ?
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One has a custom Vortek kit and the other a JM kit. Both shoot ~16fpe. Both guns feel great to me. The wind that normally precedes rain showed up when shooting the R9. It still did well. Accuracy wise, it's usually a flip flop between them. I like them both, but the R9 is a little more unique.
 
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Nice groups. I have some 1.0" dots I shoot at mainly longer distance 50 to 55 yards. Since I switched to 1/4" dots at closer range and out to 40 yards, I've seen my groups shrink. Something about trying to hold on the bigger dot is harder for me to concentrate my shot. I'm shooting off of sticks, so swaying around plays a part of that.

Would be interesting if you try a smaller dot next time to see if it benefits your style of shooting.
Before I bought the stick on dots from amazon, I would just draw circles with a red sharpie on printer paper. 3/8" might be good to try.

Give it a try and see if it works.
 
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Thanks. I have tried smaller dots and they do shrink my groups. Unfortunately the reticle on my 4x Vantage scope nearly obscures the 3/4" dot at 25 yards. Forget 50.

I typically shoot better by reducing the magnification which effectively reduces the dot size. It gives me a finer aiming point and reduces purpose tremor for me. Most of my scopes are 3-9 Airmax and I seldom use higher than 6x except 50 yards out. I'm typically not a great shooter. Once in a while I get lucky so I like to gloat when it happens.
Be well
Ron
 
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German rifle,German pellets. That's my theory anyways lol. I like the Hawke AMX too. I go with their 2-7X32 model. I think the eye-box is a little tight,but oh well. It makes me pay attention to my head or eye position. I have a 3-9X40 Hawke AMX on my B-46 (it's a big air rifle). I like it but the 2-7X32 suits me and the air rifles ( HW50s & R9 ) better. Ya got a couple nice groups there(y). I use a black Paint marker to add a center dot to my pasters(y)
 
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HeyU said:
German rifle,German pellets. That's my theory anyways lol. I like the Hawke AMX too. I go with their 2-7X32 model. I think the eye-box is a little tight,but oh well. It makes me pay attention to my head or eye position. I have a 3-9X40 Hawke AMX on my B-46 (it's a big air rifle). I like it but the 2-7X32 suits me and the air rifles ( HW50s & R9 ) better. Ya got a couple nice groups there(y). I use a black Paint marker to add a center dot to my pasters(y)
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Thanks. I agree the 2-7 Airmax is a nice scope for those rifles. I like a small light scope on my Hw50. My bigger Weihrauchs get 3-9 Airmax because I don't carry them around and occasionally the higher power comes in handy. I love the airmax reticles.

Yeah there's a couple of good groups in there but I always post all of them. When I was new to springers I would get frustrated because I was always trying to match experienced people's best cherry picked groups. I post all of mine so people can have more reasonable expectations.
 
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Chase the average group not the best groups! There are just too many variables between spring guns and pellets for every group to be jaw dropping unfortunately. In my opinion, any springer that can hold a 1.5 moa average over several groups is a great shooter.

There are things that help like sorting pellets (it absolutely does help) but it also takes time. Simply weighing a tin to sort out extreme weight differences will mitigate questionable flyers. It takes about 45 minutes though and what you'll probably find is that 90% of them are good enough. Aside from that, shooting away pellets that load funny helps too. I like to have one target set aside just for those. Once again I think you'll find that 90% of them seem to land relatively close to where you'd expect them to go.

Then of course there is checking head sizes with a PelletGage. I've tried that. Its time consuming and a bit finicky. Its just easier to shoot away pellets that feel a bit off from the rest when loaded.

Just my 2 cents
 
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Sqwirl57 said:
Chase the average group not the best groups! There are just too many variables between spring guns and pellets for every group to be jaw dropping unfortunately. In my opinion, any springer that can hold a 1.5 moa average over several groups is a great shooter.

There are things that help like sorting pellets (it absolutely does help) but it also takes time. Simply weighing a tin to sort out extreme weight differences will mitigate questionable flyers. It takes about 45 minutes though and what you'll probably find is that 90% of them are good enough. Aside from that, shooting away pellets that load funny helps too. I like to have one target set aside just for those. Once again I think you'll find that 90% of them seem to land relatively close to where you'd expect them to go.

Then of course there is checking head sizes with a PelletGage. I've tried that. Its time consuming and a bit finicky. Its just easier to shoot away pellets that feel a bit off from the rest when loaded.

Just my 2 cents
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Thanks Jon. That makes a lot of sense. My standard for springers average groups is two MOA. Once in a while I'll average 1.5 MOA at 25 yards
targets. I'll occasionally make MOA or better on individual targets. As much as I get serious about the mechanics of my guns, I shoot for fun.

Weight sorting and sizing would help shrink my average group size. As would sending off pellets that load oddly. I just load straight from the tin and don't skip any. In part to keep it real but mostly because weighing and sizing pellets would take the fun out of shooting for me.

I occasionally find a tin of pellets that really work well for a particular gun and I'll mark it for that gun. That's about as far as I'll go with sorting.
I do buy decent pellets hoping to get more consistent sizing than the box store pellets. Even then the typically better brands will occasionally give you a tin or lot of tins that is consistent but undersize. JSB is more prone to this than H&N. Undersize they shoot no better than the box store pellets. It's fairly rare when it happens but it hurts when you get ten or twenty tins of them. Usually I can find a rifle that will shoot them reasonably well or I'll use them for informal shooting.

Anyway as you pointed out shooting springers is a crap shoot of variables. I love it but without a sense of humor I'd end up pulling my hair out.
 
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Mycapt65 said:
Thanks Jon. That makes a lot of sense. My standard for springers average groups is two MOA. Once in a while I'll average 1.5 MOA at 25 yards
targets. I'll occasionally make MOA or better on individual targets. As much as I get serious about the mechanics of my guns, I shoot for fun.

Weight sorting and sizing would help shrink my average group size. As would sending off pellets that load oddly. I just load straight from the tin and don't skip any. In part to keep it real but mostly because weighing and sizing pellets would take the fun out of shooting for me.

I occasionally find a tin of pellets that really work well for a particular gun and I'll mark it for that gun. That's about as far as I'll go with sorting.
I do buy decent pellets hoping to get more consistent sizing than the box store pellets. Even then the typically better brands will occasionally give you a tin or lot of tins that is consistent but undersize. JSB is more prone to this than H&N. Undersize they shoot no better than the box store pellets. It's fairly rare when it happens but it hurts when you get ten or twenty tins of them. Usually I can find a rifle that will shoot them reasonably well or I'll use them for informal shooting.

Anyway as you pointed out shooting springers is a crap shoot of variables. I love it but without a sense of humor I'd end up pulling my hair out.
Click to expand...
You are also basically shooting from your lap if memory serves which makes 1.5moa even more impressive. 2 moa is definitely good too

Screenshot_20240223-092151_Range Buddy.jpg
 
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Sqwirl57 said:
You are also basically shooting from your lap if memory serves which makes 1.5moa even more impressive. 2 moa is definitely good too

View attachment 438479
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IMG_4969.jpg

Thanks for taking the time to size my groups. I really appreciate that. This is my typical positioning. I use a Walmart folding table for support, but the gun only touches my hands. Well that and my fat face and shoulder😅
 
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HeyU said:
German rifle,German pellets. That's my theory anyways lol. I like the Hawke AMX too. I go with their 2-7X32 model. I think the eye-box is a little tight,but oh well. It makes me pay attention to my head or eye position. I have a 3-9X40 Hawke AMX on my B-46 (it's a big air rifle). I like it but the 2-7X32 suits me and the air rifles ( HW50s & R9 ) better. Ya got a couple nice groups there(y). I use a black Paint marker to add a center dot to my pasters(y)
Click to expand...
I've seen some using off center points of aim, like putting the bull in the corner, and I scratch my head and wonder why? That may be the answer.
 
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