If you go down in magnification 8 to 12 at anything under 25 yards they work fine. A little blurry but works for me. They sell a light weight version in 30 mms that goes down to 10 yards. They are 6 x24 and 4x16. Notes with 4x16 and veteran with 6 x 24 both have 50 mm lens up front. I use Arken...