I was today years old, when I realized... (scope zeroing).

[Don.Chipmunk-slayer]

I recently had to rezero my scope, so I YouTube'd it.

Prior to this last time, I would shoot, click the turret a bit, shoot again, adjust the turret more and so on.

When I looked at YouTube, several videos demonstrated a "3 shot zero," and it caught my interest. What's more, several people on the forums suggested that as well.

I tried to do it, but got it wrong and my shots were even farther from my POA, so I clicked back a bunch and did it my old way (it still didn't sink in). UNTIL ... I watched a different video on the subject. Then I went out and tried it again.

This time, I was within a click or two of having a perfect group. I finished and went about my way.

Later, I was thinking about the technique. The first time, I had done it BACKWARDS! I'd held the scope on the POI and adjusted until the crosshairs were on the POINT OF AIM .... WRONG!!!! After watching the the second video, I'd held the crosshairs on the point of aim, and adjusted the turrets until the POINT OF IMPACT had moved to under the crosshairs!

Then it did hit me. You're NOT moving the crosshairs over the field of view, you're moving the field of view UNDER the crosshairs!!! NOW, it all made sense, and wow, do I feel dumb!

I'm sure I'm late to this party, but on the off chance there's someone else who is as confused as I was, maybe this will help.

 

[Deerstalker]

I recently had to rezero my scope, so I YouTube'd it.

Prior to this last time, I would shoot, click the turret a bit, shoot again, adjust the turret more and so on.

When I looked at YouTube, several videos demonstrated a "3 shot zero," and it caught my interest. What's more, several people on the forums suggested that as well.

I tried to do it, but got it wrong and my shots were even farther from my POA, so I clicked back a bunch and did it my old way (it still didn't sink in). UNTIL ... I watched a different video on the subject. Then I went out and tried it again.

This time, I was within a click or two of having a perfect group. I finished and went about my way.

Later, I was thinking about the technique. The first time, I had done it BACKWARDS! I'd held the scope on the POI and adjusted until the crosshairs were on the POINT OF AIM .... WRONG!!!! After watching the the second video, I'd held the crosshairs on the point of aim, and adjusted the turrets until the POINT OF IMPACT had moved to under the crosshairs!

Then it did hit me. You're NOT moving the crosshairs over the field of view, you're moving the field of view UNDER the crosshairs!!! NOW, it all made sense, and wow, do I feel dumb!

I'm sure I'm late to this party, but on the off chance there's someone else who is as confused as I was, maybe this will help.

This site has a lot of excellent scope info & may help some folks.
https://www.rimfirecentral.com/thre...ounts-super-sticky-questions-try-here.496141/

 

[6gun]

I recently had to rezero my scope, so I YouTube'd it.

Prior to this last time, I would shoot, click the turret a bit, shoot again, adjust the turret more and so on.

When I looked at YouTube, several videos demonstrated a "3 shot zero," and it caught my interest. What's more, several people on the forums suggested that as well.

I tried to do it, but got it wrong and my shots were even farther from my POA, so I clicked back a bunch and did it my old way (it still didn't sink in). UNTIL ... I watched a different video on the subject. Then I went out and tried it again.

This time, I was within a click or two of having a perfect group. I finished and went about my way.

Later, I was thinking about the technique. The first time, I had done it BACKWARDS! I'd held the scope on the POI and adjusted until the crosshairs were on the POINT OF AIM .... WRONG!!!! After watching the the second video, I'd held the crosshairs on the point of aim, and adjusted the turrets until the POINT OF IMPACT had moved to under the crosshairs!

Then it did hit me. You're NOT moving the crosshairs over the field of view, you're moving the field of view UNDER the crosshairs!!! NOW, it all made sense, and wow, do I feel dumb!

I'm sure I'm late to this party, but on the off chance there's someone else who is as confused as I was, maybe this will help.

I DO NOT want to distract you from your understanding of it.

This is just how I understand it and zeroing guns can be a 4 day a week thing depending on how bored I got and changed my guns without upsetting me. Sandbag the gun or just consider it stationary. The gun shoots where it shoots on the target, move your aiming system to where the gun shot to show you where the gun hits, so when you point the sights at something you are pointing the gun where it hits in its current configuration. Irons to video sights this is how I tend to do it if you have adjustable rings it gets more interesting when you move the scope and not the turrets to bring elevation where you hit on initial zero.

My grasp on it all is why I will never mess with 2nd focal plane optics ever again. Zoom changes everything for 2fp scopes, i like to take an ititial shot and read the reticle for the change needed. I see 10 moa of windage correction needed, I dial ten and don't waste too much ammo.

The dnt zulus is even more hilarious. Take a shot, aim as you did for the shot and take a screencap, if the screencap was accurate you just move the reticle to where it shows the hit in the screencap and more often than not you get a 2 or 3 shot perfect zero. That concept changed it all for my brain.

I sincerely hope this doesn't mess you up, and just adds some context to future readers or a different way to grasp what is happening. Also if you ever ruin a scope with a springer, cut it apart and see how all the guts work.

 

[6gun]

This site has a lot of excellent scope info & may help some folks.
https://www.rimfirecentral.com/thre...ounts-super-sticky-questions-try-here.496141/

Wow, I haven't been there in sooo long, but im in there.

 

[Don.Chipmunk-slayer]

I DO NOT want to distract you from your understanding of it.

This is just how I understand it and zeroing guns can be a 4 day a week thing depending on how bored I got and changed my guns without upsetting me. Sandbag the gun or just consider it stationary. The gun shoots where it shoots on the target, move your aiming system to where the gun shot to show you where the gun hits, so when you point the sights at something you are pointing the gun where it hits in its current configuration. Irons to video sights this is how I tend to do it if you have adjustable rings it gets more interesting when you move the scope and not the turrets to bring elevation where you hit on initial zero.

My grasp on it all is why I will never mess with 2nd focal plane optics ever again. Zoom changes everything for 2fp scopes, i like to take an ititial shot and read the reticle for the change needed. I see 10 moa of windage correction needed, I dial ten and don't waste too much ammo.

The dnt zulus is even more hilarious. Take a shot, aim as you did for the shot and take a screencap, if the screencap was accurate you just move the reticle to where it shows the hit in the screencap and more often than not you get a 2 or 3 shot perfect zero. That concept changed it all for my brain.

I sincerely hope this doesn't mess you up, and just adds some context to future readers or a different way to grasp what is happening. Also if you ever ruin a scope with a springer, cut it apart and see how all the guts work.

Don't worry, you didn't mess up my understanding ... because I don't understand what you said

 

[6gun]

Don't worry, you didn't mess up my understanding ... because I don't understand what you said

Dude, you have no idea how big of a problem that's been in my life.

 

[orion]

I did a video that will help you with the dialing of the scopes, when this clicked on my brain it's second nature now

 

[Don.Chipmunk-slayer]

Nice video.

 

[SDellinger]

I DO NOT want to distract you from your understanding of it.

This is just how I understand it and zeroing guns can be a 4 day a week thing depending on how bored I got and changed my guns without upsetting me. Sandbag the gun or just consider it stationary. The gun shoots where it shoots on the target, move your aiming system to where the gun shot to show you where the gun hits, so when you point the sights at something you are pointing the gun where it hits in its current configuration. Irons to video sights this is how I tend to do it if you have adjustable rings it gets more interesting when you move the scope and not the turrets to bring elevation where you hit on initial zero.

My grasp on it all is why I will never mess with 2nd focal plane optics ever again. Zoom changes everything for 2fp scopes, i like to take an ititial shot and read the reticle for the change needed. I see 10 moa of windage correction needed, I dial ten and don't waste too much ammo.

The dnt zulus is even more hilarious. Take a shot, aim as you did for the shot and take a screencap, if the screencap was accurate you just move the reticle to where it shows the hit in the screencap and more often than not you get a 2 or 3 shot perfect zero. That concept changed it all for my brain.

I sincerely hope this doesn't mess you up, and just adds some context to future readers or a different way to grasp what is happening. Also if you ever ruin a scope with a springer, cut it apart and see how all the guts work.

Zoom changes on a sfp scope do not change the point of impact. If you dial a sfp scope it isn't any different than dialing a ffp scope. The crosshair isn't effected, only the other parts of the reticle like mildots or other lines. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[MartinT]

Zoom changes on a sfp scope do not change the point of impact. If you dial a sfp scope it isn't any different than dialing a ffp scope. The crosshair isn't effected, only the other parts of the reticle like mildots or other lines. Correct me if I'm wrong.

You’re absolutely right, but the keypoint is: DIAL IN. If you don’t then you have to correct the SFP stadia (the hashmarks) for different zoom levels. Another reason why you would always want to dial in or use an FFP scope altogether (Unless the rules of the game prohibit dialling/touching the scope of course…)

 

[Racer88]

Zoom changes on a sfp scope do not change the point of impact. If you dial a sfp scope it isn't any different than dialing a ffp scope. The crosshair isn't effected, only the other parts of the reticle like mildots or other lines. Correct me if I'm wrong.

You’re absolutely right, but the keypoint is: DIAL IN. If you don’t then you have to correct the SFP stadia (the hashmarks) for different zoom levels. Another reason why you would always want to dial in or use an FFP scope altogether (Unless the rules of the game prohibit dialling/touching the scope of course…)

With an FFP (first focal plane) scope, the reticle changes size with the zoom, while keeping the angular measurement (MOA / MIL) presented by the subtension references constant. With a SFP (second focal plane) scope, the reticle does not change size but the angular measurements (MOA / MIL) from the subtensions will change proportionally if you zoom in or out from the calibration magnification.

With BOTH FFP and SFP scopes, the position of the center of the reticle (crosshair) stays constant. If it's zeroed at your shooting distance, POA = POI (point of aim = point of impact).

So, with a SFP scope, look to the manual for the subtension angular measurements AND which zoom setting it's calibrated for. My SFP scope, a
Hawke 4-16x44 Airmax 30 SF Compact, for example, is calibrated at 10X on the zoom. So, the "mil dots" on my scope reticle represent a 1 mil angular measurement... at 10X. If I change the zoom from 10X, then I have to do some math to figure out the angular measurements between the dots.

So when I'm doing a zero, or if I want to use my reticle subtensions to calculate bullet drop and use the hold-off method instead of dialing, 10X on the zoom (where the scope's reticle is calibrated) is going to make that much easier. Again, look to your SFP scope manual to find the magnification for which the reticle is calibrated.

With a FFP scope, again, the measurements between the subtensions are constant at any magnfication.

I hope that made sense!

 

[beerthief]

I recently had to rezero my scope, so I YouTube'd it.

Prior to this last time, I would shoot, click the turret a bit, shoot again, adjust the turret more and so on.

When I looked at YouTube, several videos demonstrated a "3 shot zero," and it caught my interest. What's more, several people on the forums suggested that as well.

I tried to do it, but got it wrong and my shots were even farther from my POA, so I clicked back a bunch and did it my old way (it still didn't sink in). UNTIL ... I watched a different video on the subject. Then I went out and tried it again.

This time, I was within a click or two of having a perfect group. I finished and went about my way.

Later, I was thinking about the technique. The first time, I had done it BACKWARDS! I'd held the scope on the POI and adjusted until the crosshairs were on the POINT OF AIM .... WRONG!!!! After watching the the second video, I'd held the crosshairs on the point of aim, and adjusted the turrets until the POINT OF IMPACT had moved to under the crosshairs!

Then it did hit me. You're NOT moving the crosshairs over the field of view, you're moving the field of view UNDER the crosshairs!!! NOW, it all made sense, and wow, do I feel dumb!

I'm sure I'm late to this party, but on the off chance there's someone else who is as confused as I was, maybe this will help.

Exactly ! your not dumb , WE just didnt explain it correctly .

 

[Don.Chipmunk-slayer]

Exactly ! your not dumb , WE just didnt explain it correctly .

Maybe, maybe not.

If I READ instructions, I have to reread them several times before it sinks in.

If I SEE an actual demonstration (and remove my head from the dark recessed area), I pick it up really quick.

In this case, even though I saw it done (once), my head was still tightly tucked away and the actual concept was missed.

 

[BradAir]

I've gone to the method you described about moving the crosshairs to the shot. Don't even have to know the movement per click. This is a quick way to get a rough zero, then fine tune with a couple clicks. This works great with a new mounted scope to the rig and a big piece of cardboard to catch the first hits. I place a single orange 1" dot on a big piece of fresh cardboard. I used to borescope guns first, but that can be a real chore. I find slapping on a scope and starting at 50yds with the cardboard gets me near zero with two shots typically. (50yds for powder burners, 25 for airguns)

 

[6gun]

Zoom changes on a sfp scope do not change the point of impact. If you dial a sfp scope it isn't any different than dialing a ffp scope. The crosshair isn't effected, only the other parts of the reticle like mildots or other lines. Correct me if I'm wrong.

FOR EXAMPLE my disco with a vortex viper pst. If I shoot my close target at 68 yards, it's 2 moa at 3x, it's 12 moa at 10x and that is effected by the zoom you used when you zeroed. If you don't change zoom it's not a huge ordeal, but i have to because that stupid vortex is fixed parallax. It's personal preference, the precision and consistency I'm after combined with a wide ranging selection of bird perches makes 2fp untenable for me. My 1fp optics allow me to range-dial-shoot with no consideration for zoom and my read on wind tends to be more correct with 1fp. I know guys will justify their purchases, but hey I have an almost 800 dollar scope I hate on a 200 dollar gun I love, I have nothing to gain.

 

[SLICKNICK]

You can use a laser to assist you zeroing. Put a mark on target that laser will always point to. Take a shot, while maintaining laser on mark you first made. Keep laser pointed and mark, and move crosshairs to bullet hole. Done

 

[Deerstalker]

With an FFP (first focal plane) scope, the reticle changes size with the zoom, while keeping the angular measurement (MOA / MIL) presented by the subtension references constant. With a SFP (second focal plane) scope, the reticle does not change size but the angular measurements (MOA / MIL) from the subtensions will change proportionally if you zoom in or out from the calibration magnification.

With BOTH FFP and SFP scopes, the position of the center of the reticle (crosshair) stays constant. If it's zeroed at your shooting distance, POA = POI (point of aim = point of impact).

So, with a SFP scope, look to the manual for the subtension angular measurements AND which zoom setting it's calibrated for. My SFP scope, a
Hawke 4-16x44 Airmax 30 SF Compact, for example, is calibrated at 10X on the zoom. So, the "mil dots" on my scope reticle represent a 1 mil angular measurement... at 10X. If I change the zoom from 10X, then I have to do some math to figure out the angular measurements between the dots.

View attachment 576587

So when I'm doing a zero, or if I want to use my reticle subtensions to calculate bullet drop and use the hold-off method instead of dialing, 10X on the zoom (where the scope's reticle is calibrated) is going to make that much easier. Again, look to your SFP scope manual to find the magnification for which the reticle is calibrated.

With a FFP scope, again, the measurements between the subtensions are constant at any magnfication.

I hope that made sense!

 

[Deerstalker]

This may help some.
Rifle scope sighting adjustment, POA = point of aim & POI = point of impact.

• 1. Start with the rifle/scope securely mounted on a table/bench where it will remain stationary with NO movement.
• 2. Use a paper target that is set out at 25 to 100 yards from rifle/scope.
• 3. Fire a 3 shot group without moving rifle/scope using the same (POA) for each shot.
• 4. Look through the scope and locate the center of this 3 shot group on the target (POI) and make sure that the rifle/scope is NOT moved.
• 5. WITHOUT moving rifle/scope, adjust crosshairs on the scope to the center of this 3 shot group. The scope crosshairs will now be pointing at the center of the 3 shot group fired by this rifle/scope combo at this sight in range
• 6. Repeat steps 3, 4, & 5 to confirm or fine tune the accuracy of the scope adjustment.

 

[Don.Chipmunk-slayer]

Since I have a single-shot pump, I wouldn't be able to shoot a group with it locked down. But still, I'd be able to fire one shot, adjust the crosshairs to THAT POI. Then fine tune it with the rifle on a full rest, just not locked down.

On a magazine fed / PCP rifle, your idea would be ideal.

 

[Bramezy]

Just remember your always moving the bullet to where you want it to land when your adjusting left and right and up and down. Bullet hits low, you want to adjust it UP.