Hawke 4-16 x 44 mm IR, SF compact on HW95L using Hawke Tactical 2 piece medium rings leaves less than 1/8" clearance for objective lens.
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Compact bullpup scope
- Thread starter Dairyboy
- Start date
I really enjoy my Acog Ta33 with 300 BLK reticle if going very lightweight as it is only 8-9 ounces, enough of mag for hunting, and bulletproof. If wanting more mag or wanting to dial I like the NF 2.5-10x42 NXS. It's a second focal plane scope, but not a problem at 10 power for holds, and only 5 mils/rotation but has a zero stop.
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ToKeepAndBear,
I just checked out the NF 2.5-10×42 NXS you mentioned.
Looks like a great little scope! But did I see this correctly? It has a 25-yard minimum parallax?
I could live with 15y. With 20y not so much. 25y is totally out of the question.... — I'm bummed that so many scope manufacturers like NightForce disregard the needs of airgunners.....
Matthias
I just checked out the NF 2.5-10×42 NXS you mentioned.
Looks like a great little scope! But did I see this correctly? It has a 25-yard minimum parallax?
I could live with 15y. With 20y not so much. 25y is totally out of the question.... — I'm bummed that so many scope manufacturers like NightForce disregard the needs of airgunners.....
Matthias
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I'd never looked up the specs on that NF scope either. Really nice illuminated reticle! I could imagine that it would appeal to many air gunners, despite the 25 yd min parallax adjustment.
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I just had to swap some scopes around so I had to order one. Took a chance on a Hawk 30 compact 4-16. It will be going on a bullpup. Hope I didn’t make a mistake. Was going to order one of my tried and true powder burner scopes for just a couple bucks more but, well, hopefully curiosity doesn’t kill the cat.
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I think that you will find that many scopes that have a 25 to 35 yard minimum focus will actually focus closer especially at lower power. I have a Leupold side focus with a 35 yard min. focus, and I am able to use it @ 20 yards with no problem. If you shoot closer than 20 yards, perhaps open sights would be a better option.
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That is the listed minimum parallax but in practice it has not been a problem. If I am shooting 20 yards and closer I shoot at 5 power to increase field of view anyway. I have killed a lot of chipmunks this year in the 12-20 yard range without a problem.
The NF is a great option to much larger scopes. I had a Hensoldt 4-16x56 on my Maverick for a bit and it was just too darn big. The NF 2.5-10x42 NXS is a pretty killer little scope. Not much out there, as far as competition, that is that light with adjustable parallax and quality build.
I recently bought a second one of the 2.5-10x42 NXS scopes if that tells you anything.
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My requirements for air rifle (PCP) and rimfire are very similar to the OP. I want compact and light with as high a quality as I can afford. Since you are talking about a PCP, which are easy on scopes, all my Rimfires would work.
Some of my favorites: (You'll notice most are discontinued)
-Burris Timberline 4.5x14 -- longer than average eye relief. Discontinued
-Weaver R7 -- Weaver Rimfire R7 2.5-7x28mm (discontinued)
-Hawke Vantage 2-7x32 AO ($119)
-Leupold: VX1 3x9 AO Discontinued
-Leupold: VX2 4x12 AO Discontinued
Vector Velyron - extremely similar to the US Optics but $100+ less expensive
I also have that US Optics T12 on a rimfire (just bought it). Very nice! I was able to get it for less money ... $349 at:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08B8DTLZT/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Caution: If you ever look through a March it will be difficult to live with anything else. Been there and done that. Sort of like letting a realtor show you a house you can't afford.
Some of my favorites: (You'll notice most are discontinued)
-Burris Timberline 4.5x14 -- longer than average eye relief. Discontinued
-Weaver R7 -- Weaver Rimfire R7 2.5-7x28mm (discontinued)
-Hawke Vantage 2-7x32 AO ($119)
-Leupold: VX1 3x9 AO Discontinued
-Leupold: VX2 4x12 AO Discontinued
Vector Velyron - extremely similar to the US Optics but $100+ less expensive
I also have that US Optics T12 on a rimfire (just bought it). Very nice! I was able to get it for less money ... $349 at:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08B8DTLZT/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Caution: If you ever look through a March it will be difficult to live with anything else. Been there and done that. Sort of like letting a realtor show you a house you can't afford.
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What you NEED — and what you DON'T:
Critical Questions And Scope Specs Tables to Narrow it Down
The options are indeed huge....
To pear these down, here are a few critical decisions to make to narrow down what you really need.
And at the end of this post find attached 2 Scope Specs Tables for different magnification ranges that will help you to weed out scopes that don't fulfill your requirements.
(1)
How much are you willing to spend? The line that I hated hearing (and that I now will repeat because it has a lot of truth to it), is: Buy once, cry once.
The Scope Specs Tables have anywhere from under $200 to over $700, both manufacturer's price and typical street prices are listed.
(2a)
At your ranges, will have have to frequently adjust your point of impact (POI) for because you shoot at ranges other than your zero range?
Or will the power of the gun and the weight of the pellet give you a flat enough trajectory at your typical ranges that you rarely need to make POI adustments — as to say, most of your shots will be in your point blank range (PBR)?
If you don't need to make frequent adjustments — then the following specs are not really important:
—— in order to adjust POI with the turrets: exposed turrets — or capped turrets?
—— in order to adjust POI with the reticle: holdoff reticle (evenly spaced hash marks or dots) — or plain crosshairs (or BDC reticle)
(2b)
Similar but expanded question: Will you need to adjust the POI frequently — AND will you use the holdoff reticle to do so?
If you don't use the reticle then an SFP scope is just fine — as an FFP scope will just increase the price. (SFP = second focal plane | FFP = first focal plane).
The advantage of an FFP scope is that the amount of holdoff you write down on your dope card (or memorize) will always be the same, no matter what magnification you use. For an SFP scope the holdoff is different with every magnification.
(3)
What field of view (FoV) will you need at the bottom end of the magnification?
This depends on the type of shooting you plan to do: A wide FoV is important for rushed close range hunting shots. Shots at stationary targets and shots are mid and longer ranges will be fine with a narrower FoV.
The Specs Tables show you the FoV for each scope — because the magnification is only a general guide: One scope at 3x can have a FoV of 40ft, another only 28ft (both measured at 100y).
(4)
What maximum magnification do your really need?
This depends on the following:
(a) What will be the farthest ranges you'll possibly be shooting at?
(b) What do you want to see through your scope at those farthest ranges:
— Your target (bulls' eye/ kill zone)
— Your hits on the paper target (this requires much more magnification)
(c) How good are your eyes? Are you over 50? I wouldn't have believed it, but this makes a big difference.
You read the advice from others — it's better to have extra magnification left in your scope and not needing it — than needing more magnification and not having it....
(5)
Is are really light scope or a really short scope important?
The Specs Table give you that info.
ALSO INCLUDED IN THE SPECS TABLES:
——The kind of warranty
——Illuminated reticle or not
——At what power the SFP reticle is calibrated
——How much elevation adjustment the scope has
——Turrets and reticle are MIL/MIL — or MOA/MOA — or an unhealthy mix & unmatch
——Reticles with grid style
——Locking turrets
——Zero stop
——Turret revolution counter
——Thickness of the reticle lines (cross hairs)
MOST SCOPES IN THE SPECS TABLES HAVE:
——10 yard min. parallax (some 15y, as noted)
——Almost all have parallax side focus (SF), not an adjustable objective (AO) – I can hold the gun more stable if I don’t need to reach way out there.
The two Scope Spec Table are:
——Short Scopes (any magni*) -and- 3-12x, 3-9x *[any magnification if at least 3-9x]
——4-14x Magnification, also 3-18x, 4-20x, and similar
(I have another Scope Specs Table, for 6-24x Magnification, also 5-20x, 5-30x) — but for your 35y range that might be more than necessary.)
Matthias
2 ATTACHMENTS:
Short Scopes -and- 3-12x, 3-9x
View attachment SCOPE Specs Table. For Short Scopes and 3-12x 3-9x Scopes.1624514647.pdf
4-16x (and 3-18x, 4-20x, and similar)
View attachment SCOPES Specs Table. For 4-16x or 3-18x or 4-20x Scopes.1624514672.pdf
Critical Questions And Scope Specs Tables to Narrow it Down
The options are indeed huge....
To pear these down, here are a few critical decisions to make to narrow down what you really need.
And at the end of this post find attached 2 Scope Specs Tables for different magnification ranges that will help you to weed out scopes that don't fulfill your requirements.
(1)
How much are you willing to spend? The line that I hated hearing (and that I now will repeat because it has a lot of truth to it), is: Buy once, cry once.
The Scope Specs Tables have anywhere from under $200 to over $700, both manufacturer's price and typical street prices are listed.
(2a)
At your ranges, will have have to frequently adjust your point of impact (POI) for because you shoot at ranges other than your zero range?
Or will the power of the gun and the weight of the pellet give you a flat enough trajectory at your typical ranges that you rarely need to make POI adustments — as to say, most of your shots will be in your point blank range (PBR)?
If you don't need to make frequent adjustments — then the following specs are not really important:
—— in order to adjust POI with the turrets: exposed turrets — or capped turrets?
—— in order to adjust POI with the reticle: holdoff reticle (evenly spaced hash marks or dots) — or plain crosshairs (or BDC reticle)
(2b)
Similar but expanded question: Will you need to adjust the POI frequently — AND will you use the holdoff reticle to do so?
If you don't use the reticle then an SFP scope is just fine — as an FFP scope will just increase the price. (SFP = second focal plane | FFP = first focal plane).
The advantage of an FFP scope is that the amount of holdoff you write down on your dope card (or memorize) will always be the same, no matter what magnification you use. For an SFP scope the holdoff is different with every magnification.
(3)
What field of view (FoV) will you need at the bottom end of the magnification?
This depends on the type of shooting you plan to do: A wide FoV is important for rushed close range hunting shots. Shots at stationary targets and shots are mid and longer ranges will be fine with a narrower FoV.
The Specs Tables show you the FoV for each scope — because the magnification is only a general guide: One scope at 3x can have a FoV of 40ft, another only 28ft (both measured at 100y).
(4)
What maximum magnification do your really need?
This depends on the following:
(a) What will be the farthest ranges you'll possibly be shooting at?
(b) What do you want to see through your scope at those farthest ranges:
— Your target (bulls' eye/ kill zone)
— Your hits on the paper target (this requires much more magnification)
(c) How good are your eyes? Are you over 50? I wouldn't have believed it, but this makes a big difference.
You read the advice from others — it's better to have extra magnification left in your scope and not needing it — than needing more magnification and not having it....
(5)
Is are really light scope or a really short scope important?
The Specs Table give you that info.
ALSO INCLUDED IN THE SPECS TABLES:
——The kind of warranty
——Illuminated reticle or not
——At what power the SFP reticle is calibrated
——How much elevation adjustment the scope has
——Turrets and reticle are MIL/MIL — or MOA/MOA — or an unhealthy mix & unmatch
——Reticles with grid style
——Locking turrets
——Zero stop
——Turret revolution counter
——Thickness of the reticle lines (cross hairs)
MOST SCOPES IN THE SPECS TABLES HAVE:
——10 yard min. parallax (some 15y, as noted)
——Almost all have parallax side focus (SF), not an adjustable objective (AO) – I can hold the gun more stable if I don’t need to reach way out there.
The two Scope Spec Table are:
——Short Scopes (any magni*) -and- 3-12x, 3-9x *[any magnification if at least 3-9x]
——4-14x Magnification, also 3-18x, 4-20x, and similar
(I have another Scope Specs Table, for 6-24x Magnification, also 5-20x, 5-30x) — but for your 35y range that might be more than necessary.)
Matthias
2 ATTACHMENTS:
Short Scopes -and- 3-12x, 3-9x
4-16x (and 3-18x, 4-20x, and similar)
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Patrick, I just noticed turret slot on my new Hawke Sidewinder the other day. I had heard about "slop" and wondered what all the fuss was about. I am new to airguns. When I caught the slop, then I realized how important not having it was. Thanks. S7
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Patrick, bringing this old thread back up for a question. Had you ever given the Vortex Razor LHT FFP a test drive? Maybe not "compact" in terms of length, but the weight is about 20 oz. And its considerably less $$ than the AMG.
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I eventually bought a 2nd Helos G2 2-12x42 DMR.
This is a scope I always want on hand because it's crazy versatile.
It's not a benchrest scope but it is capable of so much else.
I have mine on the rifles more suitable for pairing with. The main being Steyr PRO X which it seems perfect for. Great for shooting fast on small steel in offhand since the reticle is on the thicker side.
I've used them on other airguns even past 100y and find that on normal sized steel there is little disadvantage compared to 6-24's or similar because my airguns aren't moa capable most of the time anyway.
Recently I put one of these on my converted Thomas PFT pistol for the AZ state match. It was so awesome for this event!!! An easy to see reticle and the scope ranges darn good. It helped me win the event.
I named this pistol PRP/Purple Reign Pistol. Or The PERP which is also short for Perpetrator, lol.
This is a scope I always want on hand because it's crazy versatile.
It's not a benchrest scope but it is capable of so much else.
I have mine on the rifles more suitable for pairing with. The main being Steyr PRO X which it seems perfect for. Great for shooting fast on small steel in offhand since the reticle is on the thicker side.
I've used them on other airguns even past 100y and find that on normal sized steel there is little disadvantage compared to 6-24's or similar because my airguns aren't moa capable most of the time anyway.
Recently I put one of these on my converted Thomas PFT pistol for the AZ state match. It was so awesome for this event!!! An easy to see reticle and the scope ranges darn good. It helped me win the event.
I named this pistol PRP/Purple Reign Pistol. Or The PERP which is also short for Perpetrator, lol.
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Congrats, Steve, on your WIN! 
Yeah, that scope is nice, I'd like to have one.
The horseshoe reticle ("circle of death" sounds so much better!) would be great to see in other scopes.
For my personal use, the extreme wide FoV at 2x is more than I need — so in keeping with a 6-fold magnification range — a 3-18x would be much more useful to me.
However..., for the PP700 I'm using a Tactacam FTS, so that adds a couple of inches on a platform that is already super short to start with. So, not to extend the scope/camera beyond the pistol I keep to the super compact scopes (Discovery VT-3 = Vector Veyron = USO TS-12X).
Matthias
Yeah, that scope is nice, I'd like to have one.
The horseshoe reticle ("circle of death" sounds so much better!) would be great to see in other scopes.
For my personal use, the extreme wide FoV at 2x is more than I need — so in keeping with a 6-fold magnification range — a 3-18x would be much more useful to me.
However..., for the PP700 I'm using a Tactacam FTS, so that adds a couple of inches on a platform that is already super short to start with. So, not to extend the scope/camera beyond the pistol I keep to the super compact scopes (Discovery VT-3 = Vector Veyron = USO TS-12X).
Matthias
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I am going to go way against the grain here but I recently just bought a UTG Bugbuster 3-12x32 for my off hand shooting Caiman and I am THOROUGHLY impressed with it for $125 price tag that included QD pic rings. I also run a TS12x from USO on my supervet.
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So, I am not the only one that likes them........
I have a few of the etched reticle 3-12 UTG compacts and they are tough little units. They are not fancy schmancy, the reticle is not the finest, the turrets are not butter smooth, but they hold zero and keep on keeping on after several years.
Good call man!
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I love it, it is actually what I would call PERFECT for the rifle I put it on and I have no desire to change it, I may use different rings at some point because I would like the scope to sit further back so I am researching some different two piece cantilever options.
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I’ve been looking into the veyron 4-16 ffp with illuminated reticle. They’re super compact, are FFP (I prefer so I don’t need to use my brain too much), and the IR I can use at lower mags as almost like a red dot as being as the reticles on these tend to be tough to see until you increase the mag.
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