Question while we are on the topic of bad vs good quality this is a slug mass produced and I do not understand how they get this smooth almost waxy finish witch all large pellets and slug manufacturers achieve. Please can someone enlighten me. Thanks

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Troy Bakel said:

Reality.

Bracketing with a scope versus range finder.

How close is your "estimation" to the accuracy of your equation?

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Awful, I'll estimate a squirrel head is 1.75" and next thing you know my POI is behind me.

We're talking FT and airgun hunting ranges. it's not too hard.

When I did competitive shooting it was LR unknown distance courses. I became very well practiced at this. Getting as close as possible with the Mil reading could get me reliably within 10y at 450+. Back in the days of simple Mildot Leupold 10x40 LR/T Mk.4 being the gold standard.

edit. the scopes now with the very highly marked fine reticles up to 60x allow for a VERY PRECISE MIL reading. not so easy with a fixed 10 at 875yards. I would wager if i went back to the Long distance range local to me, Gunsite Hills. if i were to have someone set out a few targets from 350-750 using my Venom 15x or EPL4 at 24x I could Tighten up those estimation error radii

Look at the gap between the dies, you will see an ever so slightly larger gap

Hi, yes — it’s lead ingress between the two parts of the split die, which pushes outward and puts pressure on the ring, making it difficult to unscrew. This happened to me once as well. What lubricant are you using? I had to clamp the whole assembly in a vice and free it with a punch and hammer.

BradAir said:

There is the whole springers ruin scopes thing, so I would suggest increase the budget $100 and get a PCP Barra 250z .22 or .25. Also get a Vevor compressor for $150. Then spend another $100-200 for a moderator. Whisper quiet & power to to make clean kills. Athlon has some great value scopes, if you can get them at non tariff increased prices.

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so now its 700 dollars,,, gun , compressor, and moderator, scope. i just want to cock a gun and shot a Ghog. silly me to think it was that simple... LOL

A pertinent analogy might be archery.

As a young adult wanting to take up bowhunting a half-century ago I was torn between a lovely little Bear Kodiak Magnum recurve and a Bear compound sitting next to one-another in a sporting goods store. I really WANTED the recurve, but compounds offered 'advantages'.

Bought the compound and used compounds for my first 15 years or so of bowhunting, shunning most of the black-hole money-pits of compound related gadgetry EVERYONE else embraced. Upon finally realizing I'd devolved into the only wooden compounds still available (Browning), never adopted a mechanical release or peep sight, and finally removed the simple pin sight to shoot instinctively, I had the epiphany that I'm a traditional archer shooting compounds!

The 'moral' of the story is this. The archery industry grew at an incredible rate virtue of compound bows, because if a newbie buys a compound you're almost guaranteed he'll fall into the mindset "All I need now to be successful is one'a them centrifugal stabilizers... and a stabilizer-attached quiver... and moonrock/carbon-alloy arrows... and lighted nocks... and...




Or sell a newbie a traditional bow and arrows, shooting glove and quiver, and DONE!



FWIW, decades later I not only owned a Kodiak Magnum, but upon becoming a custom bowyer built a press to build rosewood replicas of them. One of the loveliest bows I ever built, of Cocobolo and Bubinga, named Rosey-



.

jarmstrong said:

I use safety glasses and ear plugs, the need glasses is obvious, and when I reach fill pressure I open my bleed valve as fast as I can , which produces a loud noise that hurts my ears

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Plus 1 on the ear protection. I use the same procedure and the fast bleed is painful without "ears."

JackHughs

I sold my Panthera to buy the Micro, so I know exactly what you mean

Mrod SAM back from warranty repair. (Started losing air overnight)

NorCal David said:

For those of us who are boring… boring and practical, there is a need (or at least a goal). What is meant by practical? One of the most practical pieces of advice I have ever heard came from my little lady when I moved from the city to the country. She advised, “If your socks have burs and stickers in them, don’t throw them in the washing machine with your underwear.” So practical is not some theoretical, distant thing. You CAN be practical and it is usually good for you.

Thanks to the great advice on the forum, I have moved slowly and as deliberately as I could to achieve my two goals with fairly inexpensive purchases. There is no need to spend a thousand dollars to shoot a starling, although competition guys have loftier goals and deeper pockets. It is their hobby, but not mine. I really enjoy shooting, time in the woods, and the accuracy required for my needs. My needs are humble and I accept the limits. Yes, I have the money to go deeper, but not the desire. Boring is beautiful!

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LOL. I  never understood this. I cannot exist with only one coffee cup...

banjopicker said:

hey guys i am new to the air gun world,, i see a lot has changed since my daisy red ryder bb gun.

looking in to a break barrel stout enough to knock out groundhogs ,, thinking 25 cal,,
but which one? there are quite few choices. my maximum distance will be around 40 to 50 yards hopefully closer.

hatsan has a few in my price range.. i am looking at 300 to 350 for my budget. is this possible ? and cost of decent scope too.

thanks
doc martin

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There is the whole springers ruin scopes thing, so I would suggest increase the budget $100 and get a PCP Barra 250z .22 or .25. Also get a Vevor compressor for $150. Then spend another $100-200 for a moderator. Whisper quiet & power to to make clean kills. Athlon has some great value scopes, if you can get them at non tariff increased prices.

Myself, if that counts. Never with other people, let alone in competition. I don't even know any women who shoot airguns. Or men, come to think of it. (This is PB-crazy country.)

Yes.

When my Air Arms S500 Extra FAC was tuned for 11fpe I was able to get 200 rounds from 210cc of air with a 3000psi fill.

Mycapt65 said:

22lr subsonics. Problem solved

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With suppressor, but if he's got neighbors and someone calls the law, saying you are just shooting a pellet gun, come off much better. Lol

Standing tripod and a variety of pellets

One other visual identifying difference: if you watch both kinds in flight, the beautiful high-contrast pattern on the Mourning Dove's tail is obvious. The tail is also noticeably longer than that of the eurotrash dove.

I haze the eurotrash doves with steel cans, either the noise from shooting one when the bird is around, or by banging one with some rocks in it on a hard surface. Because their in-VA-sive, loud call is intended by the male to brag about a good potential nesting site, I also make loud noise myself to drown it out.

Aural identifying pnemonic:

In-VAAAAAAY-sive, In-VAAAAAAY-sive, In-VAAAAAAY-sive! (Eurotrash dove call, louder and repeated more often; definitely a "proclamative" sound to it, like "it's MY place, it's MY place, it's MY place")

We-ARE-Mour...Ning...Doves... (much softer and not as repetitive call of Mourning Doves; definitely a cooing sound)

Good job exterminating some of the invasives! I hope to improve my shooting enough to help out.

I’m liking the suggestions. I hadn’t considered the Wolverine but they do come up for sale the odd time on the used market. Knew they are going for close to 3k . Unfortunately AGT anything is unavailable here north of the border. I’ve already got an HW30 that does pretty much what I’m describing other than it being a PCP. I’m not opposed to a Redwolf but I would think they are quite a bit more than what I’m willing to spend. Keep em coming.

Those also do not raise the scope much

Interesting choice of design.
from what I have read … so take this with a grain of salt…. baffles in firearms are different that in air rifles. In firearms, you’re dealing with hot burning gases and gunpowder that need to be stripped away as the bullet leaves. since the bullet is traveling faster than the speed of sound, most of the suppression comes after the round has left the chamber.

On an air gun, the baffles need to be different because you have a high volume of compressed air that needs to be stripped away prior to the pellet, leaving and needs to escape somehow. That’s why I presume you see such a difference in baffle designs with something like the Donnie FL moderators. They have huge baffles and then Felt, which adds as a buffer, and then even vent holes on the sides of their tube to help leave some of the pressure.
This one appears to be much like a firearm design.
I would be really curious how the two designs compare on sound suppression and if either have an affect on pellet trajectory.

very nice looking though

Saw two coyotes 4 days in a row. Perfect excuse for an upgrade but i bet I won't see them again if I do!

22lr subsonics. Problem solved

SciueraPlumbea said:

you estimate based on size relative to the known value provided by the power of estimation and relative to the reticle.

Squirrel head...
Sparrow,
"kill zone"

It's worked long enough, this stuff is factored into thinking, magnification exists. I don't understand where you're coming from. It's effective.

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Reality.

Bracketing with a scope versus range finder.

How close is your "estimation" to the accuracy of your equation?

I am new as well and soaking in the wisdom of everyone on here. I think you'll be able to find what you need. Maybe check the classifieds. You might get lucky and find a really nice one in that budget range if you are not in a hurry. Here is a video of a guy hunting jack rabbits with a PCP that I enjoyed watching:
Good luck and happy hunting.