Congrats, that HMx is a nice looking rifle and can't wait to see pics with the scope. Almost makes me want to sell the .357 BullDog and order a RAW almost.
Upvote 0
Just ordered the new RAW HMx .357 (130 ft-lbf regulated)
- Thread starter marcella69
- Start date
Yes, it is the newer 130 fpe regulated version.
Here is a link to the adapter.
https://www.rapidairweapons.com/xcart/product.php?productid=17628&cat=268&page=1
Readers digest version of how it was explained to me. You shoot the rifle down to 150 bar (off regulator). Give the bottle a 1/4 to 1/2 rotation turn. Enough to break the seal from the rifle. "Dry fire" the rifle a couple times to relieve pressure in the regulator / breech reservoir (if there is such a thing) Ie: de-gas the rifle. Unscrew the bottle the rest of the way. screw on the adapter to bottle, refill, remove adapter and bottle is ready for future use. Screw in fresh bottle. Not sure of the technical hows and whys but I was told that using the bottle fill adapter did 2 things. Made the refill process easier, quicker and reduced the wear and tear on the threaded interconnect(s) between the bottle(s) and the rifle itself. Plus it is only a $30.00 part so if it does either or both of those things it is relatively inexpensive compared to the money spent on the rifle and spare bottle already. I already love how it was packaged and shipped. In a plain brown box. No fancy prints, pictures or printed box cover. Open the box, lift the grey foam pad and there she sits. No extra "fluff". It is like they are telling you it is what is inside that is important nothing else. We will see if it meets expectations. Here are a couple quick snaps of the un-boxing. Not very good or quality pictures as they were taken indoors in a poorly lit room.
Here is a link to the adapter.
https://www.rapidairweapons.com/xcart/product.php?productid=17628&cat=268&page=1
Readers digest version of how it was explained to me. You shoot the rifle down to 150 bar (off regulator). Give the bottle a 1/4 to 1/2 rotation turn. Enough to break the seal from the rifle. "Dry fire" the rifle a couple times to relieve pressure in the regulator / breech reservoir (if there is such a thing) Ie: de-gas the rifle. Unscrew the bottle the rest of the way. screw on the adapter to bottle, refill, remove adapter and bottle is ready for future use. Screw in fresh bottle. Not sure of the technical hows and whys but I was told that using the bottle fill adapter did 2 things. Made the refill process easier, quicker and reduced the wear and tear on the threaded interconnect(s) between the bottle(s) and the rifle itself. Plus it is only a $30.00 part so if it does either or both of those things it is relatively inexpensive compared to the money spent on the rifle and spare bottle already. I already love how it was packaged and shipped. In a plain brown box. No fancy prints, pictures or printed box cover. Open the box, lift the grey foam pad and there she sits. No extra "fluff". It is like they are telling you it is what is inside that is important nothing else. We will see if it meets expectations. Here are a couple quick snaps of the un-boxing. Not very good or quality pictures as they were taken indoors in a poorly lit room.
Upvote 0
Well, Imold; you have me by 70 fpe! I wanted more power, but me thinks 200 fpe would be a bridge too far!
Upvote 0
It's fun but I fall back to the .25 caliber and 25.4gr seems to be my happy place out on the bench. Saving up for a regulator so I can tether my 74cf tank to the .25 and/or .357 will make the bench just that much more fun.
Upvote 0
Glassman, thank you so much for this info and the pics! She is gorgeous ;-). Boy, I hope the shipping material is more substantial for my RAW; that looks pretty flimsy. That looks like only single-wall corrugated fiberboard, although it might be double-wall. At least it looks like heavy-coated paper. (I used to work in a box plant.) I live in SoCal and its coming from Minor Hill, TN! You'd think for $2,500 I'd get a nice hard case. Oh well.
The set-up on the RAW is similar to my FX Impact. The bottle is charged to 250 bar and goes off-reg at 150 bar. I always experienced some leakage when swapping bottles, just a brief minor hiss. But it cost me a couple shots. The o-ring on the gun side had to be replaced after only six months of moderate use. The leaking started to get more pronounced to where I was losing about 25 bar (about ten shots). I'm thinking now I might get an Omega 12 cu-ft 4,500 psi tank to carry in the field. That way, I don't have to swap-out bottles. Its lighter (3 lb) and smaller (11" x 4") than a 90 cu-in-er, and a hellava lot larger capacity! (339,802 cc vs.1,475 cc). The spare gun bottle is 480 cc @ 1.25 lbs. So, it would be like carrying only two spare bottles, while giving me virtually limitless shots in the field! (as opposed to only 16 more shots). Sounds like a no-brainer to me. (Unless I'm missing something here.) Please advise.
The set-up on the RAW is similar to my FX Impact. The bottle is charged to 250 bar and goes off-reg at 150 bar. I always experienced some leakage when swapping bottles, just a brief minor hiss. But it cost me a couple shots. The o-ring on the gun side had to be replaced after only six months of moderate use. The leaking started to get more pronounced to where I was losing about 25 bar (about ten shots). I'm thinking now I might get an Omega 12 cu-ft 4,500 psi tank to carry in the field. That way, I don't have to swap-out bottles. Its lighter (3 lb) and smaller (11" x 4") than a 90 cu-in-er, and a hellava lot larger capacity! (339,802 cc vs.1,475 cc). The spare gun bottle is 480 cc @ 1.25 lbs. So, it would be like carrying only two spare bottles, while giving me virtually limitless shots in the field! (as opposed to only 16 more shots). Sounds like a no-brainer to me. (Unless I'm missing something here.) Please advise.
Upvote 0
I re-crunched the numbers for a RAW .357 (130 fpe regulated) spare bottle vis-à-vis a 12 cu-ft 4,500 psi tank. I was getting 13 bottle fills on my FX Impact with my Omega 75 cu-ft 4,500 psi tank. My reasoning is that since a 12 cu-ft tank has 1/6 the capacity of a 75 cu-ft tank, I will get only two bottle refills with a 12 cu-ft tank. (The bottles on the Impact are also 480 cc 250 bar, just like the RAW bottles.)
So, I think I'm going to take your advice and stick with the spare bottle and get a bottle fill adapter. Thanks for your input, glassman
. This air gun thang just keeps getting curiouser & curiouser!
So, I think I'm going to take your advice and stick with the spare bottle and get a bottle fill adapter. Thanks for your input, glassman
. This air gun thang just keeps getting curiouser & curiouser!Upvote 0
A couple items of note. RAW rifles are shipped in plain cardboard boxes, they are double or triple boxed for shipping. Mine was in a single box because I picked it up from the dealer. Secondly I contacted the local authorized warranty and service center here in Phoenix. The gentleman there is Mark. I will be going to his shop tomorrow to get a couple hour hands on "class" / "seminar" on RAW rifles and to get educated on my .357 in particular. I have spoken with him on the phone a couple times and found him to be very helpful, knowledgeable and patient in answering any questions I have had. He mentioned that if anyone was planning on swapping out bottles on a regular basis that they would need to have a supply of bottle "o" rings as they tend to wear out and go bad after a couple swap outs. He did give me a more detailed and exact explanation of how to swap out the bottles. I highly recommend anyone call him if they have any questions. You can find his contact information on the RAW web site. If I learn anything of particular interest tomorrow I'll post it here over the weekend. My scope arrived today but I will not be mounting it until after "class" tomorrow.
Upvote 0
glassman, thank you so much for your skinny; it is proving to be extremely helpful to me. In fact, I have been saving your comments to my hard-drive for future reference. It is heartening to learn that RAW uses reinforced packaging for shipments. I am also pleased to learn that RAW has a warranty center in my neck of the woods. I live in SoCal. When I bought guns from AOA, it was so convenient having its shop, which is also the warranty center, only 360 miles away.
I am seriously considering buying an Omega 12 cu-ft 4,500 psi cf tank instead of using a spare bottle for my RAW. I am concerned, now more than ever after taking your counsel, about the leakage issues with field-swappable bottles. When I had my FX Impact, I experienced leakage issues with swapping bottles as well. It seems like the logistics of dealing with spare bottles in the field is more problematic than simply filling the gun with a pony bottle that can be carried in my backpack. Plus, with a pony bottle, I'll get the equivalent of two spare bottles in the field. This really sounds like the way to go at this point.
Please keep posting the results of your research; it is indispensable to me
I am seriously considering buying an Omega 12 cu-ft 4,500 psi cf tank instead of using a spare bottle for my RAW. I am concerned, now more than ever after taking your counsel, about the leakage issues with field-swappable bottles. When I had my FX Impact, I experienced leakage issues with swapping bottles as well. It seems like the logistics of dealing with spare bottles in the field is more problematic than simply filling the gun with a pony bottle that can be carried in my backpack. Plus, with a pony bottle, I'll get the equivalent of two spare bottles in the field. This really sounds like the way to go at this point.
Please keep posting the results of your research; it is indispensable to me
Upvote 0
Glassman, DO spend time with Mark! Should you have any desire to shoot slugs talk tkso Mark. Want to know what it "could" do if you didn't mind pushing it to the limits, .... , changes between models,... . One of the nicest and most knowledgably ( but just another one of the guys) folks out there.
John
John
Upvote 0
Well, glassman; I've pulled the trigger (sorry) on the pony bottle. I cancelled my orders for the spare bottle and bottle changing adapter with RAW, and ordered an Omega 12 cu-ft 4,500 psi cf tank from AOA. The field-swappable bottle concept looks good on paper, but evidently it is still in the beta phase.
Upvote 0
Glassman and Marcella69, what optic you planning on topping your rifle off with? I just ordered the new Athlon Helos BTR 6-24x50 FFP in Mil/Mil and should arrive next week about the same time as the rifle.
Upvote 0
I was literally coming here to ask what Mick just requested... what glass will they be wearing?
Upvote 0
Mick (and Jabba), I am putting my Hawke Sidewinder 4-16x 50 IR on her. Wow, the Athlon Helos BTR 6-24×50 FFP in Mil/Mil is a sweet ride! Man, this airgun thang is salter than firearms, fo' sho'!
Upvote 0
Because I will be using mine primarily for hunting I like to keep things simple and straight forward. I have a SWFA SS 10 x 42 side focus with a mil-quad reticle. I bought it slightly used for a good price so I'll try it out. I was originally going to order the 6 x 42 but this 10x was available at the right price so I took it. If it doesn't work out maybe I'll try putting the MTC Viper connect 3-12 x 32 that currently resides on the Wildcat. I was originally going to put the viper on the .357 but I would need to get an adapter to mount it. The mount made specifically for the viper has a dove tail clamp and the RAW has a picatinny rail on top. It is doable but I don't know .... extra parts .... raises the height of the scope ..... so. I will be mounting the SWFA sometime this weekend.
I went to "class" today. It was a very useful experience. I'm still kicking around some of the information in my head. Kind of ironic that I spend almost 2 hours with a factory representative and the only discussion we had about RAW rifles specifically were a couple questions I had specific to the .357 rifle I purchased. Most of the discussion was around why I ordered the rifle I did and the basic principals of PCP air rifles, pellets, slugs and how and why they function the way they do in relation to how I will be using my rifle. Our conversation tended to wander at times as my mind likes to jump from "sand box to sand box" as a good friend of mine refers to my trains of thought. We did fill the bottle and shoot it until it fell off the regulator. As I recall we got 16 or 17 shots with and average of just over 860 fps before it started to drop. We were able to get almost 30 shots off all the way down to just over 550 fps before the pressure became so low that the hammer held the valve open and emptied the remaining air out of the bottle. All that being said I cannot emphasize enough that if anyone has the opportunity to corner Mark it will be time (and money in my case) well spent. He comes from a background in pneumatic s and hydraulics along with his many years spent with powder burners. I probably shouldn't be saying this because it might affect my ability to get a hold of him in the future. Again I digress... I will have to collect my thoughts and start another thread about how people can and should educate themselves about any pcp rifle they're looking at purchasing.
Back on point: I purchased and received my .357. I have yet to shoot a pellet through it. Wanted to educate myself about the .357 rifle (still need to spend more time with that). Need to mount my scope. Post a picture of said rifle and scope. Then get to a location where I can sight it in and send a tin or so of pellets down range. A .357 cal air rifle is treated the same as a normal rife in terms of the rules of its' use here in Arizona. Off to a range or out to the desert more than a 1/4 mile away from any occupied building. Bummer, all of my other rifles I can, and do shoot in my back yard right in the city of Phoenix. I might have to consider moving away from town. I hear land is less expensive further out in the desert
I went to "class" today. It was a very useful experience. I'm still kicking around some of the information in my head. Kind of ironic that I spend almost 2 hours with a factory representative and the only discussion we had about RAW rifles specifically were a couple questions I had specific to the .357 rifle I purchased. Most of the discussion was around why I ordered the rifle I did and the basic principals of PCP air rifles, pellets, slugs and how and why they function the way they do in relation to how I will be using my rifle. Our conversation tended to wander at times as my mind likes to jump from "sand box to sand box" as a good friend of mine refers to my trains of thought. We did fill the bottle and shoot it until it fell off the regulator. As I recall we got 16 or 17 shots with and average of just over 860 fps before it started to drop. We were able to get almost 30 shots off all the way down to just over 550 fps before the pressure became so low that the hammer held the valve open and emptied the remaining air out of the bottle. All that being said I cannot emphasize enough that if anyone has the opportunity to corner Mark it will be time (and money in my case) well spent. He comes from a background in pneumatic s and hydraulics along with his many years spent with powder burners. I probably shouldn't be saying this because it might affect my ability to get a hold of him in the future. Again I digress... I will have to collect my thoughts and start another thread about how people can and should educate themselves about any pcp rifle they're looking at purchasing.
Back on point: I purchased and received my .357. I have yet to shoot a pellet through it. Wanted to educate myself about the .357 rifle (still need to spend more time with that). Need to mount my scope. Post a picture of said rifle and scope. Then get to a location where I can sight it in and send a tin or so of pellets down range. A .357 cal air rifle is treated the same as a normal rife in terms of the rules of its' use here in Arizona. Off to a range or out to the desert more than a 1/4 mile away from any occupied building. Bummer, all of my other rifles I can, and do shoot in my back yard right in the city of Phoenix. I might have to consider moving away from town. I hear land is less expensive further out in the desert
Upvote 0
glassman, that info is promising. I assume you were shooting JSB 81s. Those numbers give over 133 fpe @ 17 shots, even better than advertised! I hope I get those numbers with mine, which I hope to get in the next couple weeks. Sandra told me my stock was cut this week, so it shouldn't be too much longer.
Upvote 0
Marcella, Yes they were the JSB's. Remember those numbers are what I recall. As I get older my recollections are not always as accurate as I would like to think. The intention was not to record all the detailed information. It was to do 2 things. First count how many shots were on the regulator. As I recall the first few shots that were "off" the regulator were not a real serious drop. I would imagine that over 20 shots can easily be obtained with over 100 fpe at the muzzle in the stock factory setting. However, if you want, the hammer spring can be adjusted down to get more shots at a lower fpe or even up a little to get fewer but more powerful shots. All depends on what your objective is. The other part of the demonstration was to show what happens when you shoot until the pressure drops so low that the hammer held the valve open and emptied the bottle. Next time I stop by there I'll try and remember to get a detailed "chrony" sheet. I also learned that there is a 5% variance in typical chronograph readings. Also readings depend upon the quality of the chronograph, has it been calibrated, what was the temperature, the humidity and ...... Personally I just need to know that the rifle will do what I want it to do when I need it to do it. I think too many people too tied up in the all the minutia and to what end. Just to say they were able to get more shots or more fpe? If what you have is not going to give you what you want or really close to it from the factory. Get something that will! I don't understand why someone wants to try and tweak and get more out of something that the factory doesn't do. I know there is always room for improvement. Many of the periphery parts and accessories can be modified and changed. However when you change / improve / modify core aspects of a rifle it will affect other parts of the rifle also. They were all designed to function as produced. It has been my experience that whenever you start to modify and change a "tool" from what it was designed for eventually it will fail you. That is what these rifles are, tools. Just my opinion. I'll get off my soap box and retreat into my room now to ponder some more.
Upvote 0
glass, your recollection seems to be remarkable. You have a kindred spirit in me when it comes the philosophy of not modifying engineered systems. I gasp when I see what some people do to their guns! Minor cosmetic changes are one thing, but major modifications to internal components presents severe risk of catastrophic damage to the gun and serious bodily injury to those in close proximity. My position is if you want a particular performance profile, acquire a gun that is engineered to deliver those specs.
This is why I bought the new RAW HMx .357 regulated rifle. I wanted an air gun that had the power and accuracy profile of a standard .22lr rimfire with a shot count that is feasible for the field (130 fpe at the muzzle, 80 fpe @ 80 yds, and an SD of 3.00 w/ 16 regulated shots - 60+ w/ a buddy bottle). I am tickled pink with the factory settings. She should be in my hands by the end of the month. I can't wait to throw lead across my Chrony and get her out in the field for zeroing and ranging!
I look forward to your continued tutelage ;-)
This is why I bought the new RAW HMx .357 regulated rifle. I wanted an air gun that had the power and accuracy profile of a standard .22lr rimfire with a shot count that is feasible for the field (130 fpe at the muzzle, 80 fpe @ 80 yds, and an SD of 3.00 w/ 16 regulated shots - 60+ w/ a buddy bottle). I am tickled pink with the factory settings. She should be in my hands by the end of the month
. I can't wait to throw lead across my Chrony and get her out in the field for zeroing and ranging!I look forward to your continued tutelage ;-)
Upvote 0
Marcella,
I lost my morning OJ over the keyboard. "I look forward to your continued tutelage
". If we are playing follow the leader and I'm up front ...... tighten the grip on your wallet, in fact I advise putting it in a vise, cranking down as tight as she goes and throwing away the handle. I am just beginning to scratch the surface of what there is to know about pcp's and their operation. Hence my spending money for class time. Knowledge is invaluable. I am the type of person who learns by seeing things presented in person and then getting my hands dirty and doing it myself. As I have stated before I'm not interested in learning how to take everything apart and rebuild it. I just want to have a solid understanding of how and why it works and how to maintain and adjust that which is designed to be adjusted. So I learn the hard and expensive way. By the way Mark mentioned yesterday that the bottle changing concept is not "new" or in beta. It has been around for quite a long time. That was how certain rifles were designed back in England in the day, they had the same problem with "o" ring failure over time with bottle swapping. There they had smaller calibers of rifles, lower operation pressures and many many many more shots per bottle so the frequency of bottle switching was also lower. The bottles themselves do not leak. It is the o ring that seals the bottle to the breech that fails. Probably a similar situation with the impact. The other significant difference is that original rifles back in the day operated at lower pressures than the newer bigger bore .357. Lower pressure means less stress on the o rings, less stress = longer life. They still failed but not as frequently as they do with modern high pressure pcps. If I remember correctly the .357 has the highest recommended pressure of any RAW rifle, 250 bar. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that all other RAW rifles have a lower recommended fill pressures. Back to wiping up the OJ. Q-tips work quite well between the individual keys.
I lost my morning OJ over the keyboard. "I look forward to your continued tutelage
". If we are playing follow the leader and I'm up front ...... tighten the grip on your wallet, in fact I advise putting it in a vise, cranking down as tight as she goes and throwing away the handle. I am just beginning to scratch the surface of what there is to know about pcp's and their operation. Hence my spending money for class time. Knowledge is invaluable. I am the type of person who learns by seeing things presented in person and then getting my hands dirty and doing it myself. As I have stated before I'm not interested in learning how to take everything apart and rebuild it. I just want to have a solid understanding of how and why it works and how to maintain and adjust that which is designed to be adjusted. So I learn the hard and expensive way. By the way Mark mentioned yesterday that the bottle changing concept is not "new" or in beta. It has been around for quite a long time. That was how certain rifles were designed back in England in the day, they had the same problem with "o" ring failure over time with bottle swapping. There they had smaller calibers of rifles, lower operation pressures and many many many more shots per bottle so the frequency of bottle switching was also lower. The bottles themselves do not leak. It is the o ring that seals the bottle to the breech that fails. Probably a similar situation with the impact. The other significant difference is that original rifles back in the day operated at lower pressures than the newer bigger bore .357. Lower pressure means less stress on the o rings, less stress = longer life. They still failed but not as frequently as they do with modern high pressure pcps. If I remember correctly the .357 has the highest recommended pressure of any RAW rifle, 250 bar. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that all other RAW rifles have a lower recommended fill pressures. Back to wiping up the OJ. Q-tips work quite well between the individual keys.Upvote 0
Glass, don't sue me for damages to your keyboard! Your point about scratching the surface with air guns is well-taken. I grew up in a hunting culture and was immersed in firearms as a kid. (I got a 20 gauge shotgun for my 12th birthday!) I even joined the Navy and went to gun school to become a gunner's mate. I worked on many weapons platforms, all the way from small arms to large naval artillery. But I have actually learned more about ballistics since I got into airgunnery (if that's a noun) than I ever did through all that. A solid understanding of ballistics is essential to own and operate an air rifle, not to mention pneumatics, mechanics, and optics. I am thoroughly enjoying my airgun journey, a lot more than I ever did with firearms, truth be told.
You're not kidding about the financial aspect either! Holy magoalies! When I told my son how much I have spent on airguns and airgun-related paraphernalia down here in SoCal in my golden years, he about plotzed! (He thinks I'm spending his inheritance, and he ain't wrong!) Air guns are so much more complex than firearms. With firearms, most of the technology is in the ammo. With firearms, virtually all the technology is in the gun itself. Plus, I am finding air guns to be superior to firearms for small game hunting. I have certainly taken much higher rate of game with my Marauder .22 pistol, Daystate Pulsar .25, and FX Impact .30 than I ever did with rimfires and shotguns. The stealth is really a huge advantage. I am really looking forward to receiving my RAW HMx .357 (130 fpe regulated)!
I was being facetious with the "beta stage" comment. I was surprised, however, with the frequent leaking with my FX Impact bottles and the plethora of reports of others with the same issue. That's why, with my new RAW, I'm opting for carrying an Omega 12 cu-ft 4,500 psi CF tank instead of a spare bottle. I'm hoping to get more shots in the field as well as eliminating the logistics of swapping bottles.
P.S. I'll get you an economy-size box of Q-Tips for Christmas ;-)
You're not kidding about the financial aspect either! Holy magoalies! When I told my son how much I have spent on airguns and airgun-related paraphernalia down here in SoCal in my golden years, he about plotzed! (He thinks I'm spending his inheritance, and he ain't wrong!) Air guns are so much more complex than firearms. With firearms, most of the technology is in the ammo. With firearms, virtually all the technology is in the gun itself. Plus, I am finding air guns to be superior to firearms for small game hunting. I have certainly taken much higher rate of game with my Marauder .22 pistol, Daystate Pulsar .25, and FX Impact .30 than I ever did with rimfires and shotguns. The stealth is really a huge advantage. I am really looking forward to receiving my RAW HMx .357 (130 fpe regulated)!
I was being facetious with the "beta stage" comment. I was surprised, however, with the frequent leaking with my FX Impact bottles and the plethora of reports of others with the same issue. That's why, with my new RAW, I'm opting for carrying an Omega 12 cu-ft 4,500 psi CF tank instead of a spare bottle. I'm hoping to get more shots in the field as well as eliminating the logistics of swapping bottles.
P.S. I'll get you an economy-size box of Q-Tips for Christmas ;-)
Upvote 0