Have I just spoiled myself....? Looking for a higher quality FFP scope...

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BenSeager

BenSeager

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Jun 7, 2016
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MI, United States
I have some really great optics imo on my air rifles and I wanted to play with a FFP scope so I bought an athlon argos 8-32x56. I really like the FFP part but the glass doesnt seem to be quite as good as my collection of Hawke scopes they are so bright and clear I wouldnt really even say its as clear as my sidewinder 30 8-32x56. I feel a bit let down really I paid the same for both scopes but I feel the hawke is a tier above. Is there a FFP scope on the market that is up there with lets say my Frontier or my Sidewinder ED under a 1000.00 or do I have to take the jump to say an Althon Cronus? 
 
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The next level up for FFP scopes is the Weaver tactical 4-20x50 and 3-15x50, the SWFA 3-15x42 and the Sig Sauer Tango 4 line. There are others (like the Nikon Monarch and Burris FFP scopes) but you start running into 50 and 75 yard minimum focus distances.

I just went through this process myself. I was looking for the next level up from the Athlon and Primary Arms entry level products but I wanted to keep the price reasonable.

I went with the Weaver Tactical 4-20x50 FFP as I wanted the larger objective lens for low light light performance . They are currently on sale at Natchez for $700 but they are normally $850 at Midway. In terms of where they sit in the pecking order, they are comparable to the Leupold MK4 line of FFP scopes (I.e. mid-level), except they can focus down to 25 yards (instead of 75 yards). The glass is noticeably clearer than the Athlon Argos and Talos, or PA scopes once you look beyond a certain range. 

As far a being better than Hawke scopes, I feel the opposite to you in that I found my Hawke scopes to be disappointing but I quite like the Athlon Argos and Talos scopes as cheap options for the guns I don't want to invest in major glass for. They are definitely cheap scopes though.

I think the mistake you made was getting the 8-32. Most of the scope "experts" advise people to stay away from cheap high power scopes. I agree with that advice big time. I chose the 4-20x50 Weaver but if I was buying it again, I would have saved $130 and gone with the 3-15x50 which is more than enough scope for any air rifle, if the glass is good enough. 

I can clearly see the pellet holes on a dark tree bark at 50 or 60 yards on just 12x with the Weaver. An 8-32 is just not made for short range air rifle distances. 

If you can still exchange or return the Athlon, I would first try the 6-24 or better yet, the Talos 4-14x44 which is more appropriate for distances of 100 yards and less. The price is lower too so you might find the quality to be more consistent with what you paid. 

This is one one of the reasons I like the Primary Arms 4-14x44 mil dot for a cheap FFP scope. It's the best $230 I ever spent on a scope. If I pay close to $400, I would expect more but for $230 I love it for my plinker / pest control air guns. The problem with the Argos line, for me, is that $370 is a little too much to be cheap, and it starts me thinking, if I'm going to spend that much, maybe I should see what I can get for $450 or $500 and then I start being less forgiving about any issues. 

I would also say that, based on what I found when looking for my last scope, I think you need to spend more on an FFP scope than an SFP scope to get comparable glass and turrets etc. If your goal is to get the best glass you can for the money, I'd stick with an SFP. I was tempted to get the Athlon Midas or Clearidge XP5 4-20x50 scopes instead to save money but I just can't go back to SFP. If you can live with SFP, that's the way to go.

 
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Hey Delladog, I very seldom shoot at anything less than 50 yards, honestly. I'm zero'd at 60 on all 3 of my AG's. My nearest backstop is at 50 and the furthest is 100. My 6-24 and the 8-32 are both the 40 yard minimum but they are both still very clear at 35 and not bad at 30 if you dial the power down. I think a lot of it has to do with the surroundings you normally shoot in. I live in the desert southwest with lots of wide open, treeless terrain so most of my shots are stretched a little. As accurate as these finer PCP's are I find that even 50 yards gets boring pretty quick.

I do still have a Hawke SW on my Tactic so I can use if needed for some closer range shooting. Oh, btw the 10-50X60's will focus down to 10 as well, but I didn't want any more extra weight and I didn't think I really needed the 50X.

What reticle did you go with on your SIII? Both of mine are the MOA and I really like it.
Jimmy
 
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Scopes only start getting parallax errors when you go above 5 or 6x (depending on the scope). That means 4x will be clear at 15yards on a scope that only focuses down to 30yards (or even 50 yards). 

My weaver focuses down to 25 yards so I Keep it set to 4, 5 or 6x for closer range shots. I find 6x to be more than enough for any shot at 20 yards or 5x at 15 yards but, if I planned to do most or a large portion of my shooting at close range, there is no way I would choose a scope that didn't focus down to the level I wanted. 

While you can make do with a scope that doesn't focus down to 10, 15 or 25 yards, I wouldn't recommend spending a lot on a scope for an airgun that can't focus down to a max of 25 yards (but ideally lower). 

Even if 75% of your shots were beyond 50 yards, it will still be annoying not to be able to use the scope fully at 30 or 40 yards. 

The only reason i even chose a scope with a 25 yard minimum is because I use my other air guns for close range shots. I bought the scope with a 25 yard minimum to try my hand at some longer range target shooting (75 - 100 yards). Plus, any shots I take below 25 yards are hunting shots where I would have set it to 4x anyway.

For target shooting, you want to be able to focus the higher power settings at closer range for air guns. 

You should obviously get what's right for you but my advice, if you are going to spend close to $1,000 (or even $700-$800) is to choose something that will do exactly what you want, or don't bother spending the extra. You don't want to compromise or make do if you spent a lot. 

I can't speak for everyone but for me, the difference between $300-$400 glass and $700-$800 glass only becomes noticeable once you get beyond 50-60 yards and sometimes only in certain conditions. Even then, you have to know what you are looking for. That's something else to think about.

An expensive scope that is designed for 100 yards plus can even end up looking worse than the cheaper glass at close range

 
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Except focus and parallax are two separate issues, and you definitely have parallax issues even at low mag. Sight a fly at 10 yards on a 40 yard parallax scope at 3 power and move your head around, the crosshairs will move off the fly.

You can focus OK on low mag, but you'll still have to account for parallax. Doable, but you need to have a very consistent, repeatable sight picture/cheek weld.
 
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Like I said, most of my shooting (95-100%) of the time is 50 and beyond. I'm not into 25 yard bench rest shooting because there is zero activity like that in my area. For my use the 35 and 40 minimum suits me fine, no regrets. All the other scopes, and trust me I've had several that focused down to 10yds and I never used it, even at 30-40 yards. Personally, and its just my humble opinion I compare it to spending $1200-1500 on a new bow package and hunting deer out of stand at 20yds. Competitive 3D, or competitive target, a different story.

I considered the lower minimum focus when I purchased these last two scopes quite a bit, made a decision based on the scope brand, reticle choice and price and have no regrets.
Jimmy
 
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"DellaDog"Except focus and parallax are two separate issues, and you definitely have parallax issues even at low mag. Sight a fly at 10 yards on a 40 yard parallax scope at 3 power and move your head around, the crosshairs will move off the fly.

You can focus OK on low mag, but you'll still have to account for parallax. Doable, but you need to have a very consistent, repeatable sight picture/cheek weld.
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I've never seen any parallax issues at 3x or 4x. I don't usually experience either focus or parallax issues until I get above 6x. Granted, I don't do any 3 yard shooting but at 10 yards or 15 yards etc and at 3x or 4x, it's a total non-issue.

I haven't yet had a scenario with any of my scopes where there was parallax isses when the scope in focus. I.e. The point where the image was clear did not coincide with the point where parallax was corrected. I don't buy cheap high power scopes though.

I rate the SWFA glass I saw slightly above the S3 that I saw. I know it's not easy for a lot of people to go and see scopes before they buy these days but if you get a chance, I would recommend searching a little more on this topic. I remember seeing a number of user comparisons between Sightron and SWFA products on various powder burner forums. I always like to read the opinions from people who own both and have had a chance to properly test them. It's also good to hear what other scopes people are comparing them to.

If you are going to make the choice that close range focusing is something you can live without, there is a longer list of quality FFP scopes that are under $1,000 that should be considered. Brands like Burris and Zeiss become options. 

If you are buying the scope for field target and need the high power settings for guesstimating ranges, you are better off with an SFP scope. There are no quality FFP scopes under $1,000 with super wide power ranges like 3-27 or 10-50. 
 
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I have two 12x42 SWFA and love them. If you put a nylon coaster on the rear focus it is far superior to sidefocus. I have another 12x42 (because I love fixed power) but I don't use it because it has sidefocus, with rear focus I can put the coaster so I can adjust the parallax from 10m to infinity from the right side with my right hand. That way I can hold the guns weight up from the front grip with my left hand and puttpad resting on my shoulder. With SF I have to hold up the guns weight with my right hand through the grip wich hurts my wrist and is very uncomfortable.

Although I suppose if you are a bench rest shooter SF isn't so bad, but I much prefer rear focus, it also uses less internal parts so it is harder to break and more sturdy of you drop it.
 
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late 2015 I was looking for a bobcat .25 in anticipation,I bought a 6-24x50 Bushnell tactical ffp with a G2 long story short I ended up with a .22 bobcat and a scope that wouldn't focus below 25yrds and the 22 bobcat was perfect on p-2 in my back yard .I'd already fell in love with the ffp. So to fund it i sold it to a PB friend he's out past 1000 western Ks.Put a 3-12x44 ffp G2 on the bobcat.lots of fun.Miss the 24x now that I have a royal 500.I'm trying to reach out with,I recently bought A 6.5-20x42 hawk,I like it And love some of the features,made a split scope cap pic 10x on left 20x right now i can find things threw it,and shoot it on that power if need be,Really thinking MTC v pro 5-30x50 and trying,a dual or triple color # function yardage tape 10x,20x,30x since it has a magnifier,Not trying to hijack .But is that even possible?Are they easy to use?( my 6-24 on 24x The recital was thick .22s could hide behind it on plain paper up close 25yrds. But the answer is yes to your Q..always thinking I need to buy another ffp g2 24x put it on the royal I could print ONE.The highly adjustable rings made it where you don't have to pay much attention to that anymore
 
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