Ratting and penetration

[Loki_762]

Hey all,
I have a question about caliber choice and over penetration when it comes to rats. I know that my HW 110 sending Baracuda match pellets at around 900 fps will zip right through rats at 25 yards and ricochet around off my fence. I also know that my 18 ft/lb Ultra MMC will not usually over penetrate a squirrel when I use Polymags at short distances 9under 30 yards). If I were looking to dump the most energy into a target, while minimizing pass throughs, it seems like the .22 is a better choice. However, I am looking to get a dedicated rat gun (night vision, magazine fed, compact, quiet) that might not love Polymags like my Ultra, so I want something that will dump energy quickly, so that if it does pass through, it will not have enough energy to damage stuff behind it. So, my question for the masses is this: am I better getting a 17-18 ft/lb .22, like the Notos, or should I lean more towards a .177 in the 12-13 ft/lb range, like the Brocock Atomic? Or do you have another suggestion?
Thanks,
Chris

 

[markhooper]

Hey all,
I have a question about caliber choice and over penetration when it comes to rats. I know that my HW 110 sending Baracuda match pellets at around 900 fps will zip right through rats at 25 yards and ricochet around off my fence. I also know that my 18 ft/lb Ultra MMC will not usually over penetrate a squirrel when I use Polymags at short distances 9under 30 yards). If I were looking to dump the most energy into a target, while minimizing pass throughs, it seems like the .22 is a better choice. However, I am looking to get a dedicated rat gun (night vision, magazine fed, compact, quiet) that might not love Polymags like my Ultra, so I want something that will dump energy quickly, so that if it does pass through, it will not have enough energy to damage stuff behind it. So, my question for the masses is this: am I better getting a 17-18 ft/lb .22, like the Notos, or should I lean more towards a .177 in the 12-13 ft/lb range, like the Brocock Atomic? Or do you have another suggestion?
Thanks,
Chris

I don't know the answer to your question but I have the notos as a pistol, I never put the stock on because I wanted a pistol so I got the factory grips and open sights..
so I'll tell you a little bit about it.. it's very quiet and shoots well and accurate with all the ammo I have.. crossman premier round nose, jsb 18 and jsb redesigned heavy.. the heavy hits the spinners really hard.. seems to like all the ammo I have.. I usually shoot pistol 30 yards at 3" spinners..
I think it starts dropping off on the last few shots of the 4 magazines I have.. works great, not jams or issues..
my only complaint are.. the moderator is great and quiet but it's 6" long and the gun is 16" so total length is 22" as a pistol.. just too long and heavy for single hand shooting..works great rested..the stock I just pushed on before I put the pistol grips on and it was snug and good even without the screws. I'm not into pistol carbine, I would rather a rifle.. but if you want compact carbine and light weight and quiet and accurate it's a good choice.. for me the stock is too short for open sights because you get too wide in the rear sight.. but that's not a issue if you scope it.. full length picatinny rail.. and well 4 magazines per fill and each hold I think 7 rounds..
I wish they would have made the moderator screw on and off.. for use as a pistol..
not sure what ammo is best for not having over penatreation.. probably a good hollow point.. I don't have any polymags.. so I don't know if they will fit.. but the jsb redesigned heavy are pretty long..
I also have heard of others worried about passing through at close range putting just a standard pellet in backwards so it like a huge hollow point.. I might try that today for accuracy and well I can shoot into wood to compare it with forward.. I'm guessing that you would use a lighter pellets like the crossman premier hollow point though.. I think heavy will pass through..
I have never adjusted anything on it but if you want to turn down the hammer spring it's a large screwdriver slot in the back..
for my use I wish I could have gotten the attaman ap16 compact pistol 22 or the new huben gk1 pistol 22..
please let me know if you have any questions about the notos and I will be happy to try to help you know anything about it..
Mark

 

[wahoowad]

I shot my fair share of rats. Even my 7 fpe .22 Crosman 2300KT CO2 pistol and HW30 could have pass-thrus but the 7 fpe ricochet sounded a lot weaker than ricochets from my 12fpe 177 HW110 or more powerful guns. I ended up sticking with the 2300KT and wadcutters in the hope they helped with energy dumping. My choice of pellet would remain the wadcutter if it gave adequate accuracy at the yardage you will shoot. I was also able to choose which gun to use depending upon the areas I hunted and concern for ricochets.

 

[JimD]

They did not work for me in my P35-177 but several guys indicate 10 and 13 grain knockouts work well in their Stoeger bullsharks in 177. They will penetrate less than domed pellets but still may pass through rats on a lot of shots unless you decrease the regulator. My 177 is a P35 which is very similar but not exactly the same gun. The bullshark is about 6 lbs and the P35 is about 5. Both are under 30 inches long. In England the P35 comes tuned to 12 fpe. You have to order the P35 from Krale if you are in the U. S., they would probably sell you a 12 fpe gun if you asked for it. If not, the regulator is adjustable but you have to let the air out and open the air tube to get to it.

 

[Loki_762]

I shot my fair share of rats. Even my 7 fpe .22 Crosman 2300KT CO2 pistol and HW30 could have pass-thrus but the 7 fpe ricochet sounded a lot weaker than ricochets from my 12fpe 177 HW110 or more powerful guns. I ended up sticking with the 2300KT and wadcutters in the hope they helped with energy dumping. My choice of pellet would remain the wadcutter if it gave adequate accuracy at the yardage you will shoot. I was also able to choose which gun to use depending upon the areas I hunted and concern for ricochets.

How did you get your HW110 down to 12 fpe? I would love to get mine to about 13.5 fpe. Did you adjust the hammer spring?

 

[Berserkeley Mike]

If you have ballistics software like Chairgun, it might have a line in the data table "Penetration". I doubt that means "of rats" but it should help compare relative penetration. My understanding is that lighter and lower BC projectiles penetrate less, like .177 wadcutters and BBs.

 

[wahoowad]

How did you get your HW110 down to 12 fpe? I would love to get mine to about 13.5 fpe. Did you adjust the hammer spring?

I bought a 12 fpe model from Krale when they first became available

 

[Ranchibi]

My Prod tuned at approximately 12ft/lbs I see pass throughs on rats, mostly on brain shots from the side at about 15-20yds like wahoowad. Body shots on bigger rats usually stay inside the body but pass through on small/young rats and of course str8 on head shots stay inside the body.

 

[L.Leon]

Why not experiment with lowering the power on your HW110 in conjunction with beefing up the backstop where your rat kills occur? And, maybe testing some wadcutters at your typical kill distances? Rats, even the huge ones are thin skinned animals. On side shots, using dome pellets, pass-throughs are the norm.

 

[Pfddi]

I turn my BRK XR Sniper .22 down to 1/2 to 1/4 power and use a Hades 15.9g pellet and have little to no pass through. My range is usually around 10 to 21 yards. I have not yet had a problem with the rat not being killed with the Hades and the lowest power setting! The plus is that the noise level goes to the ubiquitous "mouse fart" at low power! I have the PARD NV008S-LRF mounted on the BRK. This is my main ratting gun.

 

[Florida_Man]

It really depends on the rifle and what speeds it likes best with a specific pellet. I agree with the previous post that wadcutters are a great tool at shorter ranges.